Fetish

[Lobstrich]

I have been thinking of something. It's kind of a half question half theory.
It might be a silly question, but I've been grinding my mind to figure out this one.

Fetishes. Any kind, doesn't HAVE to be a sexual one, as far as I'm concerned

Take balloon fetish (obvious choice)
Is one born with this fetish? I mean, can you grow up without knowing about balloons and then when you finally see one, does that fetish manifest itself, from it's saved spot in your brain? So to speak.

Or, does the fetish simply develop when one sees and interact with a balloon?

This question obviously, applies to all kinds of fetishes. Not only balloons.
Keep that in mind when you reply!
It might already have been resolved and answered, in a book written 50 years ago.


Though, I am still looking forward to reading your theories. =)

[Cognisant]

...values & mindset?

Given the choice I believe most of this forum's posters would prefer a partner more intelligent than themself to someone less intelligent, because we value intelligence and hold the mindset that being more intelligent is better than being less intelligent. By extension of this, the more outlandish fetishes must have some manner of personal appeal to the people they obviously appeal to... as I think of it the dominatrix fetish would appeal to people who've grown up in a value system where sex and everything related to it is seen to be "evil" or "negative", hence their catharsis in being simultaneously denied sex and symbolically punished for participating in the fetish.

Madness begets madness.
Or maybe in that particular cause the fetish is the cure?

Take balloon fetish (obvious choice)

*mind blown* There's a balloon fetish?
...
And that's obvious?

[Cogwulf]

Depends on the fetish and the person

some people into some fetishes, choking etc. have brains whos pleasure centres activate in response to pain.
For people into role playing it may be some sort of escapism
People into some things like BDSM may have some underlying psychological problems
People with balloon fetishes may just be overly attracted to the colours or the shape

Freud probably would probably have a lot to say about it

[y4r5xeym5]

Originally Posted by OreSama

*mind blown* There's a balloon fetish?

There's a fetish for everything.

[Latro]

Originally Posted by OreSama

*mind blown* There's a balloon fetish?
...
And that's obvious?

Rule 34. You obviously haven't been on the Internet very long. Or at least the parts of it that 4chan has gotten its tentacles into.

[Lobstrich]

Originally Posted by OreSama

...values & mindset?

Given the choice I believe most of this forum's posters would prefer a partner more intelligent than themself to someone less intelligent, because we value intelligence and hold the mindset that being more intelligent is better than being less intelligent. By extension of this, the more outlandish fetishes must have some manner of personal appeal to the people they obviously appeal to... as I think of it the dominatrix fetish would appeal to people who've grown up in a value system where sex and everything related to it is seen to be "evil" or "negative", hence their catharsis in being simultaneously denied sex and symbolically punished for participating in the fetish.

Madness begets madness.
Or maybe in that particular cause the fetish is the cure?

Seems like a fair theory, so you think it develops.

Hmm, I have nothing to add. Can't really 'counter' your reply. =)

[Lobstrich]

Originally Posted by Cogwulf

Depends on the fetish and the person

some people into some fetishes, choking etc. have brains whos pleasure centres activate in response to pain.
For people into role playing it may be some sort of escapism
People into some things like BDSM may have some underlying psychological problems
People with balloon fetishes may just be overly attracted to the colours or the shape

Freud probably would probably have a lot to say about it

Why are you saying this? I don't say it's not interesting.
But you are merely stating what a fetish is. You aren't really answering me as to how you think they come to exist. Develop? Manifest?

[Lobstrich]

Originally Posted by Latro

Rule 34. You obviously haven't been on the Internet very long. Or at least the parts of it that 4chan has gotten its tentacles into.

Stay on topic please.


I don't want to be an ass, but I don't want irrelevant answers either.

[Cogwulf]

Originally Posted by Lobstrich

Why are you saying this? I don't say it's not interesting.
But you are merely stating what a fetish is. You aren't really answering me as to how you think they come to exist. Develop? Manifest?

So what you're asking is not why people have fetishes, but how that fetish goes from being something inside their head to something they actually do?

[Lobstrich]

Originally Posted by Cogwulf

So what you're asking is not why people have fetishes, but how that fetish goes from being something inside their head to something they actually do?

I'm asking what I wrote in the orginial post =)

Are you born with a predeterminded fetish, Does it then manifest itself from it's spot in your brain, when you see whatever it is your fetish is.
Or does it simply develop when you see and interact with whatever it is?

[Cogwulf]

Originally Posted by Lobstrich

I'm asking what I wrote in the orginial post =)

Are you born with a predeterminded fetish, Does it then manifest itself from it's spot in your brain, when you see whatever it is your fetish is.
Or does it simply develop when you see and interact with whatever it is?

Some people may be born with a fetish, some peoples fetish may be a result of experiences in their life, it would depend.

The question as to how that manifests or develops is horrendously difficult to answer unless you consider individual cases. There may also be chicken-or-the-egg problem to answer as well.

And also a fetish isn't just a thing that a person does or doesn't have, it's a part of their personalities, and we don't even have a definition as to what a fetish is.
You could define a fetish as any out of the ordinary sexual practice, you could expand that definition to include anything sexual at all outside the act of making a baby. You could expand it as far as things such as train-spotting

You're not asking what you think you're asking. You're basically asking how everyones personality develops.

[Jesin]

So this thread is basically the nature vs nurture debate, but applied to fetishes, yes?

[Lobstrich]

Originally Posted by Cogwulf

And also a fetish isn't just a thing that a person does or doesn't have, it's a part of their personalities, and we don't even have a definition as to what a fetish is.
You could define a fetish as any out of the ordinary sexual practice, you could expand that definition to include anything sexual at all outside the act of making a baby. You could expand it as far as things such as train-spotting

You're not asking what you think you're asking. You're basically asking how everyones personality develops.

Exactly.. It's not just a "thing"


And no I'm not asking how everyones personality develops.

That would have made the sentence "How does ones personality develop?"

[Lobstrich]

Originally Posted by Jesin

So this thread is basically the nature vs nurture debate, but applied to fetishes, yes?

Well.. What do you think?

Contribute! =)

[Lobstrich]

Originally Posted by Jesin

So this thread is basically the nature vs nurture debate, but applied to fetishes, yes?

I guess you could say that.

[quietgirl]

Two sides-

1. We are born with a predispositon to be attracted to certain traits/actions that would somehow fulfil our codes desire as the right match to create a baby or fulfil some other role we have been pre-programmed for.

e.g. I like the way a mans wrist moves when he drives or speaks. Later I found that this area that I like looking at corresponds with the reproductive glands. Agility and smooth skin in this area demonstrates sufficient blood flow and health of the aforementioned organs.

2. We develop fetishs by association.

I love men in suits. I don't love the suit, I love what it represents. I could have only learnt the association through observation. However, the underlying personality traits I desire are most likely predetermined.


It is probably a combination of both.

Cool thread

[quietgirl]

Originally Posted by Cogwulf

Depends on the fetish and the person

some people into some fetishes, choking etc. have brains whos pleasure centres activate in response to pain.
For people into role playing it may be some sort of escapism
People into some things like BDSM may have some underlying psychological problems

Some random ideas...

Powerful people are sick of being played to all day and wish to be subservient. Humans were not made to rule over each other and so this redresses the balance and helps the ego to regain balance.

Humans seek self punishment in many ways, there are thousands of ways but the most commonly quoted are intoxicants, sex in the knowledge that it will lead to emotional pain, over spending that leads to long term distress. These methods of self punishment are ways to address balances. The person who seeks pain has probably caused pain to others in some form or the other and subconsciously wants to atone for it. The pleasure is in fact release of guilt.

A sedentary lifestyle may also render the rush of blood that lashings inflict pleasurable where exercise is insufficient.

The rush of blood may actually be a wake up call to a brain that has become used to following a routine system of living. It is forced to think.

If a person is possessed it will actually harm the spirit that is inside it and force it to leave.

It is just nice to watch someone in control for once especially if you live a hedonistic life. A subconscious need for discipline.

Who knows...just ideas....

[Lobstrich]

Originally Posted by quietgirl

Two sides-

1. We are born with a predispositon to be attracted to certain traits/actions that would somehow fulfil our codes desire as the right match to create a baby or fulfil some other role we have been pre-programmed for.

e.g. I like the way a mans wrist moves when he drives or speaks. Later I found that this area that I like looking at corresponds with the reproductive glands. Agility and smooth skin in this area demonstrates sufficient blood flow and health of the aforementioned organs.

2. We develop fetishs by association.

I love men in suits. I don't love the suit, I love what it represents. I could have only learnt the association through observation. However, the underlying personality traits I desire are most likely predetermined.


It is probably a combination of both.

Cool thread

Thread revive? Hehe..

Anyway, yeah. I see what you're saying. And it is probably a combination of both, maybe not? =)


(By the way. Don't expect any replies besides mine. It's an old thread, and I'm probably the only one following it, seeing that I created it. Hehe)

[quietgirl]

Originally Posted by Lobstrich

Thread revive? Hehe..

Anyway, yeah. I see what you're saying. And it is probably a combination of both, maybe not? =)


(By the way. Don't expect any replies besides mine. It's an old thread, and I'm probably the only one following it, seeing that I created it. Hehe)

Hey I just joined today. What made you think about this?

[Lobstrich]

Don't know.. Casual thinking I guess. Just "came across it"

[telepathink]

I think fetish is for many people a way to enhance their sexual experience, to find some novelty in sex that turns them on, try different things and have fun. If some people insist on their sexual experience to be done in a certain way, they are hooked on the fetish and its like a drug for them. The rest of us just try to fuck for the 101th time in a slightly different fashion. Old routines are not very exciting.

I thought I knew about every fetish - and here comes the balloon fetish I am still not sure I understand it, but I've never understood scat fetish either

[Lobstrich]

Originally Posted by telepathink

I think fetish is for many people a way to enhance their sexual experience, to find some novelty in sex that turns them on, try different things and have fun. If some people insist on their sexual experience to be done in a certain way, they are hooked on the fetish and its like a drug for them. The rest of us just try to fuck for the 101th time in a slightly different fashion. Old routines are not very exciting.

I thought I knew about every fetish - and here comes the balloon fetish I am still not sure I understand it, but I've never understood scat fetish either

A fetish doesn't have to be a sexual one.

[EyeSeeCold]

Originally Posted by quietgirl

Some random ideas...

Powerful people are sick of being played to all day and wish to be subservient. Humans were not made to rule over each other and so this redresses the balance and helps the ego to regain balance.

Humans seek self punishment in many ways, there are thousands of ways but the most commonly quoted are intoxicants, sex in the knowledge that it will lead to emotional pain, over spending that leads to long term distress. These methods of self punishment are ways to address balances. The person who seeks pain has probably caused pain to others in some form or the other and subconsciously wants to atone for it. The pleasure is in fact release of guilt.

A sedentary lifestyle may also render the rush of blood that lashings inflict pleasurable where exercise is insufficient.

The rush of blood may actually be a wake up call to a brain that has become used to following a routine system of living. It is forced to think.

If a person is possessed it will actually harm the spirit that is inside it and force it to leave.

It is just nice to watch someone in control for once especially if you live a hedonistic life. A subconscious need for discipline.

Who knows...just ideas....

Wow, I'm am truly amazed at your insight. Ok so when one occupies one end of the spectrum for so long he subconsciously desires or gets relief from being on the other end? I would like to know what you make of a typical INTPs situation: no desire for total order yet no desire for total chaos, i.e. the middle of the spectrum.

[Vrecknidj]

Off the cuff I'd say that every fetish (of the sort being described in this thread) is the result of a neurosis, and that the object of the fetish simply serves a function. It could be anything, from a person to a balloon to a kind of experience. It's the sensation that the person is after, and not the thing itself.

Dave

[Lobstrich]

Originally Posted by Vrecknidj

Off the cuff I'd say that every fetish (of the sort being described in this thread) is the result of a neurosis, and that the object of the fetish simply serves a function. It could be anything, from a person to a balloon to a kind of experience. It's the sensation that the person is after, and not the thing itself.

Dave

Thread revive?! Hehe.

Anyway. Yeah, you're basically just explaining what a fetish is. That wasn't the answer I was looking for though! =)

[snafupants]

fetishes are perhaps the result of pairing a primary reinforcer (sex) and secondary reinforcer (school uniform) inadvertently.

[SpaceYeti]

Originally Posted by Lobstrich

I have been thinking of something. It's kind of a half question half theory.
It might be a silly question, but I've been grinding my mind to figure out this one.

Fetishes. Any kind, doesn't HAVE to be a sexual one, as far as I'm concerned

Take balloon fetish (obvious choice)
Is one born with this fetish? I mean, can you grow up without knowing about balloons and then when you finally see one, does that fetish manifest itself, from it's saved spot in your brain? So to speak.

Or, does the fetish simply develop when one sees and interact with a balloon?

This question obviously, applies to all kinds of fetishes. Not only balloons.
Keep that in mind when you reply!
It might already have been resolved and answered, in a book written 50 years ago.


Though, I am still looking forward to reading your theories. =)

Potentially both. I sure don't remember anything happening that would cause me to have my fetishes, and they seem pretty innate to me. I could be wrong, of course.

[Melllvar]

Originally Posted by y4r5xeym5

There's a fetish for everything.

Oh yes.

[DesertSmeagle]

Well your definitely not born with fetishes, they are developed, probably as a child( for non sexual ones). Fetishes are probably the opposite of phobias, so when young, something you had an amazing time with, you probably still like today and you dont know why. For me, when ever i smell certain smells, or hear something like 8 but music, im instantly flooded with good feelings, probably developed during my childhood, when vedeo games were amazing to me. It could be the same with sexual things too. kinda. Maybe these fetishes made as a child might spread to a sexual kind of thing as you develop more. When your a teenager, alot of your energy goes to the repro. organs and hormones, so these sexual feelings could be mixed with what you loved as a child, so now, theoretically, i could masturbate to

YouTube - :: Keygen Soundtrack :: download Link :: For Sony Products ::

YouTube - :: Keygen Soundtrack :: download Link :: For Sony Products ::

. I feel so good when i listen to 8 bit music, like a cant get enough of it, which is the opposite of a phobia so it must be a fetish. But its only certain sounds in the music i like.
Probably why i like video games so much now haha. Im not addicted or anything but it is a hobby.

[snafupants]

^ babies have been noted to masturbate in their cribs. it seems harsh to preclude fetishes from developing at a sexually nascent age simply because the gonads and myriad hormones are not balls to the wall yet.

[DesertSmeagle]

But do babies have sexual fetishes? They recognize that the penis feels good to touch, but do they actually want to have sex?

[Dansk]

I think there can be sexual urges without necessarily having any idea what the purpose of those urges is. I'm fairly certain of that, because I remember going through that phase myself. When I found copies of my friend's dad's Penthouses, I knew liked looking at the naked women but I had no idea why. It just made me feel good. I didn't discover mastubating until two years later, which was a great big "ah HA" moment as I made the teleological connection between it and the funny feeling I was familiar with.

I think the earliest expressions of sexuality come in the simple and very common form of curiosity about the bodies of the opposite sex. (Or same sex as the case may be.) Sometimes those early experiences can form patterns that later become fetishes. For example, in the case of Exhibit A--myself--my discovery that girls have different plumbing came when I was 7 years old and watched my neighbour peeing in the back yard. That image fascinated me and became an obsession, which turned into a fetish over the years.

That's my personal theory: fetishes are the result of childhood experiences that may either manifest themselves at the time, or go unnoticed for many years before emerging.

I can't imagine any possible way fetishes could be innate, unless you want to go the Platonic route and suggest that we don't learn things, we simply "un-forget" them.

[Lobstrich]

Originally Posted by DesertSmeagle

Well your definitely not born with fetishes, they are developed, probably as a child( for non sexual ones). Fetishes are probably the opposite of phobias, so when young, something you had an amazing time with, you probably still like today and you dont know why. For me, when ever i smell certain smells, or hear something like 8 but music, im instantly flooded with good feelings, probably developed during my childhood, when vedeo games were amazing to me. It could be the same with sexual things too. kinda. Maybe these fetishes made as a child might spread to a sexual kind of thing as you develop more. When your a teenager, alot of your energy goes to the repro. organs and hormones, so these sexual feelings could be mixed with what you loved as a child.

I think this is probably the answer I agree with most. But somehow, even though you said that one is not born with fetishes and that it develops during interaction with the respective "object"

I have this question; Am I bound to develop this fetish? Will I have it "hidden" in my head, and then have it manifest when I interact with whatever it is?

I've really been grinding my mind about this for some reason.

[Dansk]

I think that's where things get complicated, and I'm not sure that anyone has a good answer as to why some people develop fetishes when exposed to a stimulus and why others don't. God knows I've seen enough feet in my life, but the idea of a foot fetish is a huge turn-off for me. iunno.


Og jeg kan godt forstå det der styk visdom i dit underskrift. Det synes jeg ogsaa.

[Lobstrich]

Originally Posted by Dansk

I think that's where things get complicated, and I'm not sure that anyone has a good answer as to why some people develop fetishes when exposed to a stimulus and why others don't. God knows I've seen enough feet in my life, but the idea of a foot fetish is a huge turn-off for me. iunno.


Og jeg kan godt forstå det der styk visdom i dit underskrift. Det synes jeg ogsaa.

Cool! Don't tell anyone though! =)

[SpaceYeti]

Originally Posted by DesertSmeagle

But do babies have sexual fetishes? They recognize that the penis feels good to touch, but do they actually want to have sex?

I remember being attracted to women (and girls my age) since I can remember anything at all. I didn't know what sex was, but I still wanted to do it with them. Asking the question you asked is like asking "Sure, children get hungry, but do they realize they want to eat food?". At first, probably technically not. But only because they don't yet grasp the concept. Being hungry is pretty much the same essential thing as wanting to eat food, only one necessitates understanding that there's something called "food" and you eat it.

[DesertSmeagle]

Originally Posted by Lobstrich

I think this is probably the answer I agree with most. But somehow, even though you said that one is not born with fetishes and that it develops during interaction with the respective "object"

I have this question; Am I bound to develop this fetish? Will I have it "hidden" in my head, and then have it manifest when I interact with whatever it is?

I've really been grinding my mind about this for some reason.

I think that it doesnt spontaneously manifest, but its with you forever. Like if you have anything you like a little too much now, or if you have an object that you have some kind of unnatural attraction too, you can still like it, and then it might form into a sexual fetsih or it might not. If you have the unexplained urge to be around an object for no apparent reason, thats probably a fetish.

I know that we go through developmental phases of...curiosity maybe..when we grow up .. it starts out as oral, thats why babies put things in their mouhts, and goes from oral to talking, thats why 3 and 4 year olds ask so many random questions. and we go through these stages, and when we hit puberty or so, the curiosity thing goes right to your reproductive organs, so if you have something u love uncontrollably, you might have sexual enrgy towards it, as you did in other stages with different parts of your body. I doubt this happens often, but it does happen.

[EyeSeeCold]

^I agree, I think Freud was right on the money with his oral fixation and psychosexual theories. Notice how ESTPs can be hyper conversationalists, hypersexual and childlike? The one I lusted for in my old topic, out of nowhere took out a nice, moist red apple and tenderly sunk her teeth into its thinly layered skin until she penetrated the surface, gently closing her lips around the desired parts she wished to possess insider her mouth and firmly took a bite, gracefully wiping up the juice that trickled down her chin. All the while I'm sitting there with my chin on the ground, my tongue on the desk and my eyes wide open. Now that's oral fixation for ya.

[Agent Intellect]

Autogynephilia seems to be an inborn fetish that occurs in transgendered individuals.

Fetishes (paraphilias) haven't really been pinpointed as far as cause goes. I'm interested in where 'preference' ends and 'fetish' begins. I've always had strange tastes in women (at least by most other peoples standards), as far as preference goes, but that doesn't mean that women outside that preference aren't appealing to me. Does fetishism require that one simply prefers something culturally unorthodox, or that said preference is exclusive (they don't have any interest outside their fetish)?

[SpaceYeti]

Originally Posted by Agent Intellect

Autogynephilia seems to be an inborn fetish that occurs in transgendered individuals.

Fetishes (paraphilias) haven't really been pinpointed as far as cause goes. I'm interested in where 'preference' ends and 'fetish' begins. I've always had strange tastes in women (at least by most other peoples standards), as far as preference goes, but that doesn't mean that women outside that preference aren't appealing to me. Does fetishism require that one simply prefers something culturally unorthodox, or that said preference is exclusive (they don't have any interest outside their fetish)?

Sexual fetishes require that the thing so desired is necessary to enjoy/orgasm, whether actually there or simply imagined.

[Lobstrich]

Originally Posted by EyeSeeCold

^I agree, I think Freud was right on the money with his oral fixation and psychosexual theories. Notice how ESTPs can be hyper conversationalists, hypersexual and childlike? The one I lusted for in my old topic, out of nowhere took out a nice, moist red apple and tenderly sunk her teeth into its thinly layered skin until she penetrated the surface, gently closing her lips around the desired parts she wished to possess insider her mouth and firmly took a bite, gracefully wiping up the juice that trickled down her chin. All the while I'm sitting there with my chin on the ground, my tongue on the desk and my eyes wide open. Now that's oral fixation for ya.

You probably right..

But to clarify, you're agreeing with me? As in we ARE born with predeterminded fetishes, that develop when we interact with it?

Or did I miss something here? Heh.

[EyeSeeCold]

Originally Posted by Lobstrich

You probably right..

But to clarify, you're agreeing with me? As in we ARE born with predeterminded fetishes, that develop when we interact with it?

Or did I miss something here? Heh.

Well, to say we are born with archetypal fetishes would imply that genetics is involved and, consequentially, there exists an instinctual need for a fetish. In this logical deduction, the only needs I can come up with are breast feeding and strictly sexual intercourse. The genetic explanation is plausible for those, but any other fetishes, I think would have arose out of an arbitrary nurture factor during a specific psychosexual stage.

Could it be possible that someone stuck in an immature psychosexual stage is attracted to others in that same stage, age and behavior-wise? The attraction would be due to the behavior being sort of a beacon of identification for others who are similar, providing relief or provoking erotic desires(the need to reproduce).

[Lobstrich]

Originally Posted by EyeSeeCold

Well, to say we are born with archetypal fetishes would imply that genetics is involved and, consequentially, there exists an instinctual need for a fetish. In this logical deduction, the only needs I can come up with are breast feeding and strictly sexual intercourse. The genetic explanation is plausible for those, but any other fetishes, I think would have arose out of an arbitrary nurture factor during a specific psychosexual stage.

Agreed =)

[Cognisant]

They only way to be sure is to get a large number of people, sort them by what fetishes they have, and create a forced-mating breeding program in an attempt to isolate the genetics responsible.

There will also need to be a control group, any volunteers?

For Science!

[bloozie]

Guys with eyeglasses on...

[Lobstrich]

Originally Posted by Cognisant

They only way to be sure is to get a large number of people, sort them by what fetishes they have, and create a forced-mating breeding program in an attempt to isolate the genetics responsible.

There will also need to be a control group, any volunteers?

For Science!

I'd volunteer if it excluded all the really weird fetishes - You know, food, "showers" and whatnot.

[Cognisant]

Of course, crossbreeding would defeat the point.

Inbreeding on the other hand...

[Dansk]

Originally Posted by Cognisant

Of course, crossbreeding would defeat the point.

Inbreeding on the other hand...

That's a fetish all it's own.

[Adaire]

Well to do such an experiment in a reasonable amount of time we'd have to genetically engineer short-lived, fast developing samples without compromising the ultimate results (y'know that could be what we already are).

anyway
fedoras

[Cognisant]

That's exactly what we are.
A species lives only as long as it needs to in order to reproduce and ensure the survival of its offspring, other than that there is of course absolutely no reason why women can outlive their equivalent male peers by an order of a decade or two.

Theoretically there's no reason why humans couldn't live for several hundred years, especially if our development wasn't rushed in under about two decades, although everything's there and operational from the very begging of puberty, which is completely ill-suited to our modern lifestyle, imo puberty should start at 30, ideally just after the growth period ends.

Hmmm, fully grown teenagers, yeah okay maybe that's a bad idea

Edit: Who exactly is fedoras?