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Psychology of Death Metal

EyeSeeCold

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A genre is defined by the similarities in the sound. The things similar about death metal that make it death metal, I dislike.
Genres don't account for the subjective experience.

What is it with you people..


What is it with you people and disliking labels? I hate people who dislike labels. I call my cup a "cup" because that's what it is. Sure, labels may be used poorly or wrongly by ignorant jerks, but that doesn't mean they're innately bad or in any way inaccurate.
I'm not a metalhead. I just happen to listen to death metal. So it wouldn't benefit your reasoning to group me with everyone else.

I should have stated earlier that I was saying what I said tongue in cheek. While it is actually my tastes, I don't presume anyone should share my tastes. Death Metal sucks because it's a wall of noise with no melody. And I just listened to a bunch of songs on that list of supposedly good songs. Our tastes are different. I'm not going to judge an entire genre by the few songs which people claim are good (yet I've been entirely unable to find), because I'd rather judge the genre as a genre. I then use that understanding of the genre to determine if I'd rather waste time listening to it or doing something else. That's how humans work.
Opinions, people have them.
 

Sensi Star

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^ That pretty much goes for every genre..still, the sound exists in the music, not the genre. Labels don't do any justice for the musicians when there are too many negative associations.
Labelophobia much? I don't see what the big fuss is over labels. Can't see how one can realistically pretend that labels are innacurate. Sure you have your few scarce exceptions, but I'd say 90%+ of material that is labeled death metal contains obvious patterns that consistently present across songs. This just so happens to be true of every other music 'label' as well IME. Seems accurate to me. And also, negative associations apply to pretty much any genre. Though couldn't one genre having more of them indicate that it contains more elements that make it unappealing to a larger audience? Unless such associations prevent one from listening to the genre for an unbiased evaluation, it's just a case of 'the people have spoken', no? Just some thoughts.

I call my cup a "cup" because that's what it is. Sure, labels may be used poorly or wrongly by ignorant jerks, but that doesn't mean they're innately bad or in any way inaccurate...
t h a n k y o u
 

Artsu Tharaz

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Re: Crush the holy priest

"Labelophobia much?"

The problem is with judging something negatively because it happens to be in the same grouping as other things which you judge negatively. PREJUDICE.

If the very things you dislike about the group are those things that define the group, and no matter what other qualities a particular instance has you would not be able to look past those disliked aspects, well then fair enough.

YouTube - Morbid Angel- Enshrined By Grace
 

Anthile

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You're terrible people. All of you.
 

5k17

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Death metal is not a genre, it is a supergenre; however, the term is often applied to any/all of its subgenres, since some of them have misleading names or none at all.
Or perhaps it actually is a genre, and what I'd regard as subgenres are just influences from other genres?
 

Artsu Tharaz

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I thought metal was the genre, death metal was the sub-genre, and the rest are just stylistic sub-divisions?
 

Artsu Tharaz

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Re: /w\

I think I'll post black metal videos. I like that (sub)-genre more, I think.

Yes, I think I'll do just that.
 

Agent Intellect

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I'm interested: how does the "metal" genre (supergenre?) break down? As an 'outsider' (someone who doesn't listen to it) it all seems fairly similar to me, as any music genre appears to an outsider (I'm curious how it breaks down for electronic music, too).

As for my last post (first page) I concede that music preference is an indicator of personality. I suppose what I was thinking of was temperament.
 

Cavallier

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You know, a lot of what's being said here could also be said for the more experimental sorts of Jazz. Bitches Brew anybody? It's not about death, destruction, or terror* but it is difficult to access or appreciate without a lot of work and training. A lot of people think it's loud, jarring, and not really music since they can't ferret out the rhythm for all the syncopation.

*Though a lot of it could be. Some of the best experimental jazz pieces I've heard were very disturbing.
 

Anthile

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Basically, Metal is a subgenre of Rock and is loosely defined by the instruments used.
It's not easy to pinpoint the exact subgenres as Metal bands often combine various styles from in- and outside of Metal.
Often new genres emerge through a location or as a movement in a country and sometimes slowly begin to disappear after a while. Gothenburg Death, German Power Metal, Bay Area Thrash, Florida Death, Norwegian Black Metal; you name it.

I don't think there is any point in time that can be described as a Big Bang of Metal. Some argue that bands like Deep Purple, Uriah Heep, Wishbone Ash or Blue Öyster Cult were the first Metal bands and that is true, to some extent, as they share a lot of motifs like epic lyrics, featuring fantasy stories and often based on literature. But by modern standards, they really are just Hard Rock. The most influential band in this context would be, of course, Black Sabbath.
The best way to begin would be the New Wave of British Heavy Metal that brought us bands like Iron Maiden, Diamond Head, Motörhead, Saxon and a lot of other, lesser known bands. From there on, some bands decided to play Metal a bit faster and it was called Speed Metal. Then it also occurred that the band Venom released the album "Black Metal" and while it wasn't very good, it was highly influential to not only Black (duh) but also Thrash Metal.
Sometime in the mid-80s, the Swiss band Celtic Frost released the two albums To Mega Therion and Into The Pandemonium which remain to this day two of the most influential records in Metal history, especially for Extreme Metal.
Now Extreme Metal doesn't mean anything at all, it's just an umbrella term for Thrash Metal, Doom Metal, Death Metal and Black Metal. Contrary to popular opinion, Grindcore is not Metal. As the -core suffix suggests, it's a subgenre of Hardcore Punk These are not called Extreme Metal for nothing, though. Not only do they (mostly) sound extreme but also contain extreme lyrics - despair, suicide, violence and similar things. They also have very... unique scenes.
All of that branched out in the 90s and nowadays we have so many (useless) subgenres that I can legitimately say that I can show you anything, from "Scottish Pirate Metal" to "Electronic Art Metal" from Greece.
 

Cavallier

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Thank you! Finally somebody made a list of things to look up if I ever want to really get into metal. I would like to hear this "Scottish pirate metal" if you don't mind.
 

Puffy

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You know, a lot of what's being said here could also be said for the more experimental sorts of Jazz. Bitches Brew anybody? It's not about death, destruction, or terror* but it is difficult to access or appreciate without a lot of work and training. A lot of people think it's loud, jarring, and not really music since they can't ferret out the rhythm for all the syncopation.

*Though a lot of it could be. Some of the best experimental jazz pieces I've heard were very disturbing.
Yes, thank you. I love Bitches Brew (: I think Captain Beefheart's Trout Mask Replica has that similar feel to it. (I'm sorry I have brought it up on a lot of other threads - it just stands out as a great album to me.) It is a combination of blues rock and jazz - I think you might like it if you are in to that kind of abstract music.

It this interesting that metal has a community that it brings with it. Most people I know that actively listen to metal music tend to socialise with people that do likewise. There has not been enough comment on the social/ psychological aspects of the music on this thread I think. I used to listen to it a lot but strayed to listen to other genres. I am sure I will come back some time, it just often sounds too heavy for me now.
 

Artsu Tharaz

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Re: Complete guide to metal

Roughly there is:
- Heavy metal: early metal like Sabbath, NWOBHM like Maiden, various other styles

- Speed/thrash metal: Metallica, Slayer

- Death Metal: what we've been discussing

- Black Metal: Burzum, Darkthrone, Beherit, Bathory

- Doom Metal: this genre makes no sense. It starts as styles of heavy metal and death metal, then develops further to be inclusive of lots of heavy, gloomy styles of metal. I think INTPs are probably pretty into this stuff.
Candlemass (heavy), Winter (death), Eyehategod, My Dying Bride, Electric Wizard, Skepticism (Skepticism and Eyehategod are apparently part of the same sub-genre lolwat)

- Power metal: includes folk metal, prog metal, symphonic metal and melodeth
Blind Guardian, Dragonforce, Dark Tranquility, Eluveite, Finntroll, Dream Theater, Nightwish

Thrash punk and grindcore should be looked into along with extreme metal, these evolved along side thrash metal and death metal.
- DRI, Corrosion of Conformity; Napalm Death, Blood, Bolt Thrower

I think that's about it.
 

Sensi Star

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There has not been enough comment on the social/ psychological aspects of the music on this thread I think.
Thank you for noticing this. There is a reason I posted this in the Psychology forum.

It's turned into a Death Metal appreciation / classification thread.
 

EyeSeeCold

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Thank you! Finally somebody made a list of things to look up if I ever want to really get into metal. I would like to hear this "Scottish pirate metal" if you don't mind.
It's pretty much the same format as Folk metal, gimmicky stuff. Sometimes it's generally good though.
 

Artsu Tharaz

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Thank you for noticing this. There is a reason I posted this in the Psychology forum.
I feel that maybe I should try and get us focused on this topic again.

To start with, let's continue by comparing Death Metal to the various other interests one may have that share a common link with it, as has been mentioned in the thread thus far. Let's be systematic and general about this.

Other art: the aesthetic is similar to horror such as Lovecraft - Cthulu is a recurring theme in death metal, and generalising this we can look at what else is recurring in the genre. There is lots of other horror and gore present in Death Metal, so we can address Psychology of Death Metal with Psychology of Horror (like horror movies, we have the artistically viable classics, with most of the later stuff being cheesy rip-offs which focus on the gore but leave out the real purpose of the art).

We could make comparisons with visual art, perhaps using album covers as a spring-board:


Death metal has been compared in this thread to, say, football (an aspect of it, at least - the raw energy), and primitive tribal activities. I think this comparison is quite apt - the raw energy of Death Metal, the moving of the spirit, the Thumos, is certainly a big part of its appeal. Perhaps similarly to early paganism, we see a certain inclination towards violence - war, the typically unpleasant aspects of life. Death metal is frequently discussed as being tied to an acceptance of the unpleasant truths of reality, and the darker elements of the human psyche. This is a good starting point.

Someone also mentioned, with regards to the tribal aspect, the notion of belonging - well, we could express this otherwise as being a tendency towards destruction of the ego, by assimilating the self with a larger expression of life. I don't think it's so much the connecting with other people aspect of belonging that drives this in higher metal, so much as connecting with the higher aspects of life - a bowing down towards a greater power, a reverence. We could even go so far as to call such metal - through its (sub-)cultural and spiritual (a moving of the spirit, worship of the abstract) aspects - religious.
 

Puffy

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I think you have pointed out many important aspects which I will need to think on. Around the time in my life I listened to metal music frequently I also absorbed myself in horror fiction - so perhaps there is some connection. I will have to try and recall my mental state from the time.

If I am being honest 'the sense of belonging' seems about right. I do believe metal music carries a community. In the time of my life I valued this genre I often used to base whether I would befriend someone off of their music taste - it was a common identity. This makes more sense in a school environment I suppose where everyone is eager to have a social identity and will hence come to associate more.

If I had to generalise the metal fans I knew were the people more inclined to feel rejected by the popular culture - hence the setting up/ joining of a sub-culture in which they may feel a part of a whole.

I don't personally identify with the tribal aspects you refer to such as violence. But I never used to join in with moshing etc, so that might just have been me not fully embracing the culture/ keeping a distance.
 

kantor1003

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Artsu: Kinda funny you posted an emperor vid. I just rather recently (a couple of months ago) played with the former bassist from emperor (Tyr). He used to play with them in the early - mid 90s I think.
He (emperor) got to be the supporting band, and hang with the pantera guys. I so envy him of that. Anyways, the emperor guys live like a 20 minutes ride away from me I think. In notodden. Ishan has a studio there I believe.
 

Artsu Tharaz

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Re: Philosophy of Death Metal

Emperor are far more legendary (objectively ;) ) than Pantera. If you happen to see Ihsahn, be sure to tell him how much In the Nightside Eclipse rules, and nothing he did afterwards even comes close. Then watch him raaaage : D

@Puffy: w.r.t to the violence aspect, what I had in mind wasn't so much a tendency towards actual violence, apart from those strong bursts of energy, but more a drawing towards the ideas of violence - such as the energy felt as you read Diomedes slay Trojans and have it out with the Gods. Conflict is idealised - subjectively as an expression of the higher forces of life, as a realisation of the Will, objectively as a showdown of thesis and antithesis, with the emerging synthesis being greater than either side.

Death metal, the Destroyer, focuses mainly on the destruction of common values - it is by nature iconoclastic. Black metal, the Creator, simply setting aside what is, instead attempting to jump to another plane of existence, and represent a completely different picture of life, such as through the fantastic, mystical landscapes painted in Burzum or Emperor.

It is consistent with an observer mentality, I think - focusing less on the actualities of what is unfolding, and more on the underlying concepts, on a mythological analogue. This abstract representation of existence is common to all higher art (and may well be the measure of it).
 

Hadoblado

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It would be a boring world if we all had the same tastes. You could pose your questions of any musical genre.

However, I will say one thing and that is that for many people (especially young people) music is not just an aural experience, but forms part of an identity movement. Different genres have their own dress codes, lexicon, symbolism etc which people adopt to try to associate themselves with a certain sub-culture. It is a very primitive, tribal thing, born, I believe, of our innate desire to 'belong'.

To understand the identity aspects of death metal you would need to look at the sub-culture and analyse what values, attitudes etc it is trying to project, how 'members' interact with each other and how this all interacts with dominant (hegemonic) cultural formations .
^A beautiful summary.

I listen to many different kinds of metal, however I do not interact with the culture at all. I find it moronic to claim some sort of 'allegiance' to a genre, band, or way of life that involves mass counter conformity.

The reason for liking death metal (for me) is that it is simply more my speed. Normal music is generally too shallow, slow, quiet, mindless, catchy, predictable, unoriginal or heard too often.
 

^_\\

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hardcore shit here.

YouTube - The Postal Service - "We Will Become Silhouettes" Sub Pop Records

( don't know how to embed)



... so people actually like death metal for the music? Not just background music to shoot your school/workplace/city up by?

My main issue is the near ubiquitous AAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGHHing that goes on, usually louder than the melody. I really don't get the appeal, I love to watch cagefighting, I've spent a lot of time on 4chan, I pranked my friends with a "really cool video you should check out" (of a graphic suicide" but most songs really put me off.

My impression is its mostly a matter of reveling in the badassery/alphaness of some guy who can go AAAAAARRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGHHHH for a long time/ plus all that darkness stuff.

Could someone who enjoys the AAARRGGGHHy stuff detail the experience of enjoying it?
 

SkyWalker

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music for thinkers = do i like it? (e.g. is it harmonic, is there beauty? or is there some beauty to destruction even? etc). does it give pleasure to self?


music for feelers = do i belong to it? (e.g. to the ideology of the music). does it give pleasure to US (the group / the ideology)? and which groups does our group oppose? >> this last part is the hate part

somebody here said why do people like football, same thing for the feelers: belonging, the pleasure of loving their own group and the pleasure of hating the other group.

thinkers are more independant, they dont tend to become huge football club fans or huge music ideology fans.
if they like football, they would like all teams, and would prefer the team with the best technique for rational reasons and could switch team easily if is rational.
same for music, if they like music, they would like all genres, and would prefer the genre with the best technique for rational reasons and could switch genre easily if it is rational.

feelers dont switch for rational reasons, they are quite loyal if everything is ok and would only switch if the group betrays them and then they would switch over to the group that would be the worst enemy of the group that betrayed them.

so a feeler that has parents who listen to classical music, but feels betrayed by his parents, will get out of the family group and will flock to the death metal group simply because this group opposes the old group. The feeler can simply join the death metal group, without even knowing another death metal lover, just by playing the music he would join them: he could turn the death metal up really loud in his bedroom and annoy his parents and enjoy the HATE he has for them. this is a nice simple example where the ARRGHHH is enjoyed.

and yes the singer would be the alpha of the group that the feelers join. they think the alpha speaks for them. they agree on the ARGHH he puts out. they think he puts it out for them.

the feelers also support the alpha of the group financially (buying records and being a traitor if you dont buy it but copy it, buying tickets etc) and they cheer for him at concerts. they try to expand the group by getting more new converts etc. everything they do is bad for self, financially and time-wise, thus they sacrifice self to it. (a thinker would never get that part, since the thinker will never sacrifice self. the thinker thinks the feelers are probably just stupid or lacking in intelligence)
 

Artsu Tharaz

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music for thinkers = do i like it? (e.g. is it harmonic, is there beauty? or is there some beauty to destruction even? etc). does it give pleasure to self?


music for feelers = do i belong to it? (e.g. to the ideology of the music). does it give pleasure to US (the group / the ideology)? and which groups does our group oppose? >> this last part is the hate part
Cute, but not quite.

Ti = is it -logical-?, vs. Fe = music as a social tool. Every type -likes- the music...

Both thinkers and feelers can be independent (this is probably more an I thing). You're probably roughly correct that thinkers would pick the team based on logic, whereas a feeler would choose based on personal connection.

Please stop with the condescending, over-simplification (of Fe only, mind you), and down-right wrong characterisations of what feeling is.

Unless you're just trolling. In which case, by all means continue!
 

xbox

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I like rock, death metal, doom metal, black metal, etc. I prefer scandinavian bands

There is something enchanting about it.

Crap like cannibal corpse makes me laugh, I keep envisioning the cookie monster. :mad:
 

xbox

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Oo I wanna post music, how do you post it? :D
 

SkyWalker

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Please stop with the condescending, over-simplification (of Fe only, mind you), and down-right wrong characterisations of what feeling is.
I think you are right that I gave more of an Fe view of the Feeler. Fi will act different, but group mentality still applies for all feelers.

I would like your opinion on the below (does this correct things for you? do you agree on the below?)

----

In the case of the teenage feeler that joins the group "death metal" to oppose the family group (his classical parents) who betrayed him:

If he is Fe-dom, he is an active group member:
- ACTIVE HATE: He would feel pleasure when the enemy (the parents, the family group) feels pain, thus this causes him to actively pursue opposing them. (actively turning up the volume of the death metal music in his room to annoy the classical parents).
- ACTIVE LOVE: He would feel pleasure if the friend (the death metal group) feels pleasure, thus this causes him to actively pursue helping them (promoting, cheering, buying, etc)

If he is Fi-dom, he is a passive group member:
- PASSIVE HATE: He would feel pain when the enemy (the parents, the family group) feels pleasure, thus he avoids helping them. So he wil not actively oppose, but he will "actively" avoid to help (and "actively"avoiding is more of a passive thing than an active thing). e.g. "Passive agressiveness".
- PASSIVE LOVE: He would feel pain when the friend (the death metal group) feels pain, thus he avoids opposing them. So he will not actively promote, but he will "actively" avoid getting in their way when they want to promote (thus also a more passive thing).
 

Artsu Tharaz

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I think you are way off.

Also, death metal is pretty much modern-day baroque.
 

xbox

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xbox

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Interesting.
 

xbox

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NICE
 

Sensi Star

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music for thinkers = do i like it? (e.g. is it harmonic, is there beauty? or is there some beauty to destruction even? etc). does it give pleasure to self?


music for feelers = do i belong to it? (e.g. to the ideology of the music). does it give pleasure to US (the group / the ideology)? and which groups does our group oppose? >> this last part is the hate part

somebody here said why do people like football, same thing for the feelers: belonging, the pleasure of loving their own group and the pleasure of hating the other group.

thinkers are more independant, they dont tend to become huge football club fans or huge music ideology fans.
if they like football, they would like all teams, and would prefer the team with the best technique for rational reasons and could switch team easily if is rational.
same for music, if they like music, they would like all genres, and would prefer the genre with the best technique for rational reasons and could switch genre easily if it is rational.

feelers dont switch for rational reasons, they are quite loyal if everything is ok and would only switch if the group betrays them and then they would switch over to the group that would be the worst enemy of the group that betrayed them.

so a feeler that has parents who listen to classical music, but feels betrayed by his parents, will get out of the family group and will flock to the death metal group simply because this group opposes the old group. The feeler can simply join the death metal group, without even knowing another death metal lover, just by playing the music he would join them: he could turn the death metal up really loud in his bedroom and annoy his parents and enjoy the HATE he has for them. this is a nice simple example where the ARRGHHH is enjoyed.

and yes the singer would be the alpha of the group that the feelers join. they think the alpha speaks for them. they agree on the ARGHH he puts out. they think he puts it out for them.

the feelers also support the alpha of the group financially (buying records and being a traitor if you dont buy it but copy it, buying tickets etc) and they cheer for him at concerts. they try to expand the group by getting more new converts etc. everything they do is bad for self, financially and time-wise, thus they sacrifice self to it. (a thinker would never get that part, since the thinker will never sacrifice self. the thinker thinks the feelers are probably just stupid or lacking in intelligence)
This seems to make the most sense out of all explanations. 100% of all death metal fans I've met were more or less outcasts, rebellious, and full of angst. I am convinced that their obsession with the music is sustained only by their obsession with the IDENTITY associated with it.

I, being a true thinker--having no interest in what music represents and ONLY in the experience resulting from actually listening to it--am struggling to understand what the musical appeal is. I completely understand what makes people flock towards it, but apart from this I don't see any appeal (first-hand or vicariously) in it as a MUSICAL experience, and this alone.

In other words, if you could round up all death metal fans, and use some sort of Men in Black style mind-erasing device to wipe out all cultural/identity/psychological associations pertaining to death metal, what percentage of these people will still favor the music? My guess is that it would be quite low.
 

GYX_Kid

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^ you seemed to have overlooked the part of the post you agree with, about

music for thinkers = do i like it? (e.g. is it harmonic, is there beauty? or is there some beauty to destruction even? etc). does it give pleasure to self?
apparently you as an individual don't see the beauty in that type of perceived destruction. that just sums it up. it doesn't suit your taste. if you have in fact only met those types of people who associate with solely the identity like that, then that's the extent to which you've seen/realized.

it seems like you're trying to argue for an objective truth about it not being musical, which just doesn't have any basis. i'm not going to try to push any further and seem like more of a soldier of metal than of truth.
 

Artsu Tharaz

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This seems to make the most sense out of all explanations. 100% of all death metal fans I've met were more or less outcasts, rebellious, and full of angst. I am convinced that their obsession with the music is sustained only by their obsession with the IDENTITY associated with it.

I, being a true thinker--having no interest in what music represents and ONLY in the experience resulting from actually listening to it--am struggling to understand what the musical appeal is. I completely understand what makes people flock towards it, but apart from this I don't see any appeal (first-hand or vicariously) in it as a MUSICAL experience, and this alone.

In other words, if you could round up all death metal fans, and use some sort of Men in Black style mind-erasing device to wipe out all cultural/identity/psychological associations pertaining to death metal, what percentage of these people will still favor the music? My guess is that it would be quite low.
Haha, dude. Not everyone likes the same music as you. You're going to have to just accept this.

Have some Thorns:

YouTube - THORNS - Existence
 

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I just browsed the thread, but didn't recognize any of the songs( to slow connection to listen to them).

But regarding the title of the genre, I suspect it's very subjective. I'd want something melodic, not to much noise.
 

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Do most people who listen to this have some sort of underlying darkness within them such as childhood trauma, emotional instability, self hatred, etc, for which this music provides release? What would compel someone to listen to this stuff, other than wanting to put up a front of 'hardcore' masculinity?
People who listen to death metal would certainly like you to believe that they have had some childhood trauma or some dark twisted history. The clothes, music and style are meant to represent a depth to their personality which differentiates them from the typical person. The truth is that the heavy metal theme is adopted by those who just need an excuse for there social estrangement. Your question would be music to their ears
 

GYX_Kid

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The clothes, music and style are meant to represent a depth to their personality which differentiates them from the typical person.
isn't that what a label of INTP is for?
 

Hadoblado

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isn't that what a label of INTP is for?
QFT



I honestly do believe the metal doubters have a point, a large number of metal heads I know seem to identify themselves by the music they listen to far too strongly. It took me a while to get used to death metal, I originally thought it was just noise, but then you hear a bit of death in something you're listening to and it makes you want to listen to more, until before you know it you're listening to complete death and not the songs you originally enjoyed.

Could you not apply the same arguments to all of those classy acquired tastes like red wine and caviar?
 

GYX_Kid

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I honestly do believe the metal doubters have a point, a large number of metal heads I know seem to identify themselves by the music they listen to far too strongly.
don't they seem to be less into the actual music as well? all the "metalheads" who are so into the social scene of it, most of them collect all the knowledge of underground and merch and rituals and shit but then couldn't recognize individual songs or riffs or whatever by their favorite bands. it's a shame so many female metalheads have to have so many piercings and dreadlocks. (i'm just all nerdy about particular bits of music, and not as into the social aspect- though i will proudly wear shirts of bands i like to support, and stuff like that)


anyway, the non-sonic cultural aspect seems to in many cases fill in holes for people with less defined self-concepts, or if there is more legitimacy then the music can fit in with lifestyles that (already) include LaVeyan satanism, for example. broad generalization there, though. similar to how punk culture has the stereotype of carrying with it an attitude associated with libertarianism in various contexts, and hip hop with modern-day inner city gang life. again very stereotypical generalizations. though philosophy has a much more direct correlation with lyrical content, personal lives of band members, etc.
 

Hadoblado

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My peeve is when they know everything about every gimmick genre ever contrived, and will argue for days about what genre a band belongs to. I love gimmick metal, I really do, but I will never be caught arguing about whether IWABO is avant garde or alternative grindcore, it's a completely unnecessary detail to the listening to of music.
 
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