Act Dumb

[Ribald]

Those are not the droids I am looking for?

 

[Hawkeye]

This thread.

 

[Ribald]

Thread split from Computer code discovered in the understanding of our universe

While you and I may think its immoral, a grand creator may have a completely different opinion. Who is to say that a grand creator has to think like we do?

I don't believe in god.That doesn't mean I am 100% sure there isn't a god. Sure, maybe he works in mysterious ways. That argument never did much for me, though. Occam's razor or something.

Isn't that the whole point of a simulation though?

Plus, you literally can't have good without evil. ^^

You literally can't have good without evil? LITERALLY? Shit, why the hell isn't this in our science books yet? Someone call whoever is in charge of science!!!!!!!!!

So, Hawkeye, how did you prove it? I'm all ears!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Because you can't have something for nothing; there is always a catch.

You should be a philosopher. Got any more for us? Maybe you could critique a few I've come up with:

• Live every day like it's your last
• What goes up must come down
• Aim for the moon, if you miss you'll land in the stars
• A broken clock is correct twice a day
• Literally everything happens for a reason
• What doesn't kill you makes you stronger
• There is no I in team
• Nobody's perfect, literally

Let me know what you think. I have a feeling I could be on to some cutting edge shit here.

 

[Ribald]

Re: Computer code discovered in the understanding of our universe.

 

[Hawkeye]

Re: Computer code discovered in the understanding of our universe.

You literally can't have good without evil? LITERALLY? Shit, why the hell isn't this in our science books yet? Someone call whoever is in charge of science!!!!!!!!!

So, Hawkeye, how did you prove it? I'm all ears!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Science and morality are different things.

Also, there are literally thousands of philosophical books on the topic of good and evil, and no, I won't compile them into a "...for Dummies" paragraph just for you because I don't see why I should given your response. How about you read some stuff yourself for a fucking change.

You can mock me all you want, but you are clearly a naïve know-it-all who ironically, knows very little.

Good day.

 

[redbaron]

Re: Computer code discovered in the understanding of our universe.

On a tangential note, I'm actually pretty damn frustrated myself with the convoluted nature of scientific reporting. Most people do not have access to, let alone the sufficient training to be able to read scientific journals.

This I agree with.

This is why I think all science journals should be publicly accessible, with perhaps online skilled interpreters who are able to translate and summarise the concepts in all the latest publications to the general public.

I think the only way an interpreter would work any better than scientific reporting is if they were scientists themselves. Even then, they'd have to be trained in the specific discipline to be any better than a basic science reporter. Even then I'd say they need to be trained in the specific discipline relevant to the study. A general science degree isn't enough to properly elucidate the kind of depth of information contained in a lot of hard science studies, and it often does more harm than good when people try.

It is absolutely possible to present factual findings in a manner that isn't too dumbed down.

Not sure if I agree. I think a lot of it has to do with bringing people up to speed to understand, not dumbing things down for them.

~

Ribald, you're terrible at satire.

And you're an idiot fuck too.

 

[Ribald]

Re: Computer code discovered in the understanding of our universe.

Science and morality are different things.

Also, there are literally thousands of philosophical books on the topic of good and evil, and no, I won't compile them into "...for Dummies" paragraph for you because I don't see why I should given your response. How about you read some stuff yourself for a fucking change.

You can mock me all you want, but you are clearly a naïve know-it-all who ironically, knows very little.

Good day.

Well, the fact that I am evil literally must mean that there is an opposite amount of good somewhere else in the world, because you literally can't have one without the other. So actually I don't know what you are so angry about.

 

[Hawkeye]

Re: Computer code discovered in the understanding of our universe.

Well, the fact that I am evil literally must mean that there is an opposite amount of good somewhere else in the world, because you literally can't have one without the other. So actually I don't know what you are so angry about.

I never said you were evil. I only hinted that I think you are a muppet.

 

[The Void]

Re: Computer code discovered in the understanding of our universe.

I never said you were evil. I only hinted that I think you are a muppet.

Ribald declared him\herself as evil only to make a point....

 

[The Void]

Re: Computer code discovered in the understanding of our universe.

Well, the fact that I am evil literally must mean that there is an opposite amount of good somewhere else in the world, because you literally can't have one without the other. So actually I don't know what you are so angry about.

Thats not what he meant though.
If a world only have bad and every action is bad,
then how exactly will anyone know they are facing bad, because they never felt anything good to know by comparison, that something is bad,
so bad will be just normal,
well actually in more realistic sense, they will term less bad as good and more bad as bad or something,
in fact this is how it is,
heat is lack of cold,
there is no cold,
similarly I can say there is no heat, but there is only cold and what we call heat is lack of cold,
evil and good are similar and not independant entities,
they are the same scale,
the opposite ends of the scale are so different that it seems distinct,

good is just apparently relatively less evil,
we can term something as evil only by comparing it with something good and
vice versa,

but that does not mean good stuff cannot exist,

yes we can have all good stuff and no evil, it is imaginable,
but the only difference will be probably, that we wont think anymore in terms of good and evil because all will be good, so since our concepts will disappear the good and evil will disappear too,

 

[Ribald]

Re: Computer code discovered in the understanding of our universe.

Thats not what he meant though.
If a world only have bad and every action is bad,
then how exactly will anyone know they are facing bad, because they never felt anything good to know by comparison, that something is bad,
so bad will be just normal,
well actually in more realistic sense, they will term less bad as good and more bad as bad or something,
in fact this is how it is,
heat is lack of cold,
there is no cold,
similarly I can say there is no heat, but there is only cold and what we call heat is lack of cold,
evil and good are similar and not independant entities,
they are the same scale,
the opposite ends of the scale are so different that it seems distinct,

good is just apparently relatively less evil,
we can term something as evil only by comparing it with something good and
vice versa,

but that does not mean good stuff cannot exist,

yes we can have all good stuff and no evil, it is imaginable,
but the only difference will be probably, that we wont think anymore in terms of good and evil because all will be good, so since our concepts will disappear the good and evil will disappear too,

You're also wrong, though, because under your theory everyone would be of exactly equal wellbeing (and it would average out to neutral unconditionally). You apparently deny that one person can generally be sadder or happier than another. That's folk-psychology at best; no respectable scientists, psychologists, or thinkers subscribe to this belief.

Also, why do you write your posts like a poem? What is wrong with paragraphs?

 

[The Void]

Re: Computer code discovered in the understanding of our universe.

[*]Live every day like it's your last

"oh shit this is my last day, will it end now , all into void, the next day...
oh so sad so sad....all my loved ones, i will never meet them, i am gonna go to the void,
forever for eternity, oh so tragic..this is my last day"

[*]What goes up must come down
what if it cross escape velocity?

[*]Aim for the moon, if you miss you'll land in the stars

and burn and die or wander forever in dark empty space...

[*]A broken clock is correct twice a day

Not if it is digital with date included.

[*]Literally everything happens for a reason

and what is the reason for everything happening for a reason even if everythhing indeed happens for a reason?

[*]What doesn't kill you makes you stronger

Or makes you paralyzed handicap, mentally insane, or many other thing...

[*]There is no I in team

well I am not familiar with this one

[*]Nobody's perfect, literally

I am nobody. Cheers for me!
seriously, perfect is just a vague concept that is out of my system.

 

[Ribald]

Re: Computer code discovered in the understanding of our universe.

-_-

 

[The Void]

Re: Computer code discovered in the understanding of our universe.

You're also wrong, though, because under your theory everyone would be of exactly equal wellbeing (and it would average out to neutral unconditionally). You apparently deny that one person can generally be sadder or happier than another. That's folk-psychology at best; no respectable scientists, psychologists, or thinkers subscribe to this belief.

Also, why do you write your posts like a poem? What is wrong with paragraphs?

I dont understand what you are reading,
thats not what I meant,
it is a matter of concept, good and evil are matters of concept,
I am not talking about the real feelings behind it,
we identify them with concepts,
the concept of good exists in comparison to the concept of evil,
if there is no contrasting feelings, or happenings or anything there will be no contrasting concepts identifying them.

 

[Hawkeye]

Re: Computer code discovered in the understanding of our universe.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8I9pYCl9AQ

Ribald... The Void never said that. Stop being silly.

 

[Ribald]

Re: Computer code discovered in the understanding of our universe.

I dont understand what you are reading,
thats not what I meant,
it is a matter of concept, good and evil are matters of concept,
I am not talking about the real feelings behind it,

You said:

"then how exactly will anyone know they are facing bad, because they never felt anything good to know by comparison, that something is bad,
so bad will be just normal,
well actually in more realistic sense, they will term less bad as good and more bad as bad"

That is blank slate thinking. It denies the reality that we have genetic programming that has nothing to do with what we have or haven't experienced in life. We are not blank slates.

 

[The Void]

Re: Computer code discovered in the understanding of our universe.

You said:

"then how exactly will anyone know they are facing bad, because they never felt anything good to know by comparison, that something is bad,
so bad will be just normal,
well actually in more realistic sense, they will term less bad as good and more bad as bad"

That is blank slate thinking. It denies the reality that we have genetic programming that has nothing to do with what we have or haven't experienced in life. We are not blank slates.

I was talking about a hypothetical scenario,
and genetic programming is based on evolution and adapting to the situation at hand which depends on the external reality,
and in that hypthetical world, there is nothing good, so the genetic programming will be different too, but btw the video hawkeye provided explains it much better in one or two lines, so I guess I dont need to strech it and needlessly complexify it.

 

[Hawkeye]

Re: Computer code discovered in the understanding of our universe.

You cannot live in a world of large objects without some ability to compare their size to non-large objects.

 

[Ribald]

Re: Computer code discovered in the understanding of our universe.

I was talking about a hypothetical scenario,
and genetic programming is based on evolution and adapting to the situation at hand which depends on the external reality,
and in that hypthetical world, there is nothing good, so the genetic programming will be different too, but btw the video hawkeye provided explains it much better in one or two lines, so I guess I dont need to strech it and needlessly complexify it.

The video is stupid, which makes sense given that it is an animated movie... "When everyone is super, no one will be." Honestly I thought it was a joke that it was posted, but now I'm wondering since you've apparently gone and agreed with it as an argument.

This is precisely my point, though. If everyone is super, everyone is super. Being super isn't about being better than everyone. Flying isn't fun because other people can't fly, it is fun because it is flying.

You cannot live in a world of large objects without some ability to compare their size to non-large objects.

Actually you can. My pet rabbit can't compare the size of objects, and she is alive.

As a human, there is the ability to do both. I can compare and think in relative terms, but I can also know what I perceive in an absolute sense and see things as unique.

For example, I can think "my 28th birthday party was not my most fun birthday party" and "I had a lot of fun" at the same time.

 

[Hawkeye]

Re: Computer code discovered in the understanding of our universe.

Actually you can. My pet rabbit can't compare the size of objects, and she is alive.

As a human, there is the ability to do both. I can compare and think in relative terms, but I can also know what I perceive in an absolute sense and see things as unique.

For example, I can think "my 28th birthday party was not my most fun birthday party" and "I had a lot of fun" at the same time.

So much straw man.

There are objects that are larger and smaller than your rabbit. This comparison of scale exists irrespective of whether your rabbit understands it or not.

Your birthday example only supports my point.

 

[redbaron]

Re: Computer code discovered in the understanding of our universe.

Actually you can. My pet rabbit can't compare the size of objects, and she is alive.

As a human, there is the ability to do both. I can compare and think in relative terms, but I can also know what I perceive in an absolute sense and see things as unique.

For example, I can think "my 28th birthday party was not my most fun birthday party" and "I had a lot of fun" at the same time.

 

[The Void]

Re: Computer code discovered in the understanding of our universe.

The video is stupid, which makes sense given that it is an animated movie... "When everyone is super, no one will be." Honestly I thought it was a joke that it was posted, but now I'm wondering since you've apparently gone and agreed with it as an argument.

This is precisely my point, though. If everyone is super, everyone is super. Being super isn't about being better than everyone. Flying isn't fun because other people can't fly, it is fun because it is flying.



Actually you can. My pet rabbit can't compare the size of objects, and she is alive.

As a human, there is the ability to do both. I can compare and think in relative terms, but I can also know what I perceive in an absolute sense and see things as unique.

For example, I can think "my 28th birthday party was not my most fun birthday party" and "I had a lot of fun" at the same time.

Super is by definition something better than average.
For example genius, genius is one who is highly talented or something in one area than the average,
so the genius can only exist in comparison to the threshold called average,
if everyone becomes genius, then genius will be the new average, so no one will be genius anymore,
same for super,
same for good and bad,
same for all these similar types of concepts...
Youtube cumment:

You're looking at this wrong. The quote does not imply that if everyone is super it is a bad thing. It implies that one cannot know what "super" is without having a threshold to compare it to. Ie, the "non-supers." Super, by definition, is above-average skill. In order to be above-average, we need an average to compare it to. If everybody was "super," everybody would be "above-average" by our standards but in fact just be average by society's standard.

 

[Latte]

Re: Computer code discovered in the understanding of our universe.

What the shit.

Trying to see if I understand correctly:

What happened is as follows?

Ribald used the term (not)evil as a way to narrow the parameters of the imaginary mind of some being. Describing with language of differentiation necessitating our or similar reality vantage point. And the term immoral in a similar way about a universe.

Then a tangent about evil and good as judgement / measuring concepts ensued, which wasn't relevant because from our perspective we can still describe things with that term about another universe where there is no differentiation because (from our perspective) we can still differentiate and thus use the term descriptively in communication.

Ribald engages tangent by attempting to show that experiencing what we would in this universe designate as good or bad (what is. like, the experiences. bliss, suffering) are not necessarily dependent on each other (which is true), other thread participants engage this by attempting to show that conceptually, one cannot judge/designate something as good or bad unless there is a dichotomy context (which is also true).

Is this accurate?

 

[Polaris]

Re: Thread split from Computer code discovered in the understanding of our universe

Ribald, please refrain from derailing threads by creating straw-man arguments based on unrelated details and mocking members who have a differing opinion to yours. People will not respond well to these methods. Also, redbaron has already received a warning, for the record.

 

[Ribald]

Re: Thread split from Computer code discovered in the understanding of our universe

Ribald, please refrain from derailing threads by creating straw-man arguments based on unrelated details and mocking members who have a differing opinion to yours. People will not respond well to these methods. Also, redbaron has already received a warning, for the record.

There is a big difference between calling someone an "idiot fuck" and what I did, which from what I have seen is quite par for the course. Also, I saw that redbaron was warned the first time he called me an "idiot fuck" and then, after the warning, he did it again, which I also reported, and then he stalked me into another thread to troll me there as well. For my part I did not reply to any of those posts. Any reply I give, I hold to the standard of being arguably a contribution. I always think it is, others may disagree, but ambiguity happens. No one would agree that calling someone an "idiot fuck" is a contribution. Redbaron clearly should have been banned for being warned for something and then immediately doing the same thing, thus flouting the moderator response.

Ironically, the post at the top of this thread is not a derail at all. I was directly replying to the OP about the topic in the OP [apparently this thread was moderated again after I wrote this post and it seems I get to bear full responsibility for all of the off topic posts in the thread]. Then I replied to the already derailed part of the thread. Regarding my interaction with Hawkeye, I think you have a lot of moderation left undone if you are now coaching people on the kinds of communication that will and will not work with people. It appears that I have been exclusively warned for something that is completely rampant on this forum. But I'll be sure to report any post from now on that I don't feel communicated effectively.

 

[Hawkeye]

Re: Thread split from Computer code discovered in the understanding of our universe

There was a reason why my can't have good without evil comment ended with ^^.

 

[Absurdity]

Re: Thread split from Computer code discovered in the understanding of our universe

We're dealing with redbaron privately. Worry about your own conduct.

 

[Ribald]

Re: Thread split from Computer code discovered in the understanding of our universe

As long as the same rules apply to me as they do everyone I couldn't care less. I feel somewhat angered right now because I have never stooped to the level of calling someone an "idiot fuck" repeatedly and despite being warned and yet the person who does seems to have gotten off without punishment (pending further developments, who knows what would have happened without my belaboring the issue). I don't think that's fair.

Makes me not want to be a part of this place. Maybe you guys would be better off without me.

 

[Absurdity]

Re: Thread split from Computer code discovered in the understanding of our universe

Can you read?

 

[Ribald]

Re: Thread split from Computer code discovered in the understanding of our universe

I think the situation affects me and I shouldn't be shooshed about it, nor insulted. I disapprove of your moderation and don't want to be a member here anymore. I would like to be banned, please. Absurdity, you are an idiot fuck. I guess I might have to do that a couple times to get the desired result if you all are consistent, but who knows, seems more random to me. Bye everyone.

 

[Absurdity]

Re: Thread split from Computer code discovered in the understanding of our universe

Absurdity, you are an idiot fuck.

Oh no, my feelz :'(

I am sure you will be sorely missed.

 

[Cavallier]

Re: Thread split from Computer code discovered in the understanding of our universe

I think the situation affects me and I shouldn't be shooshed about it, nor insulted. I disapprove of your moderation and don't want to be a member here anymore. I would like to be banned, please. Absurdity, you are an idiot fuck. I guess I might have to do that a couple times to get the desired result if you all are consistent, but who knows, seems more random to me. Bye everyone.

I don't really care if someone who has "found that avatars tend to influence people's perceptions of posts" and thus chose Selena Gomez to be their representation on INTPf leaves.

 

[Jennywocky]

Re: Thread split from Computer code discovered in the understanding of our universe

Chalk another kill up for my Ignore list. Sigh.

 

[Ex-User (5841)]

Re: Thread split from Computer code discovered in the understanding of our universe

I can't believe that no one pointed out that a rabbit's depth perception, key to that whole hopping thing, is all about comparing the sizes of objects.