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intp career

praisetehsun

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Im an intp (pretty much but have also tested as intj) and I wanted to ask anyone with advice for intp's - whats a good career path. I know that question can be down to the person but I identify with MANY of the intp traits ( cramming for exams, procrastination, etc.) and I still dont know.

I have considered physics because I like figuring out how things work, and architecture because I can be creative without actually having to work out all the practicalities.
I am currently going for computer science as I really like technology and working with it. Although I am not a genius at maths, but im a high-average.

TLDNR: career choice for an intp, and is computer science the course for an average, but not genius maths student?
 

Architect

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Duxwing

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Did that, don't recommend it for INTP's generally.
I'm taking AP Physics B, and I love it. :) My teacher is funny, kind, loves his subject, and has always helped me with my extra-curricular physics questions. The labs have sometimes blown my mind (spectral lines of hydrogen) and the math can be beautiful. I also feel safe... so soft and warm and safe. No vicious social dynamics. No narcissism or sadism. No emotional manipulation or leftist re-education. No schools of thought vying for minds. Just math, me, and the universe.

-Duxwing
 

Architect

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I'm taking AP Physics B, and I love it. :) My teacher is funny, kind, loves his subject, and has always helped me with my extra-curricular physics questions. The labs have sometimes blown my mind (spectral lines of hydrogen) and the math can be beautiful. I also feel safe... so soft and warm and safe. No vicious social dynamics. No narcissism or sadism. No emotional manipulation or leftist re-education. No schools of thought vying for minds. Just math, me, and the universe.
Yeah learning physics is fun, I'm talking about working at a professional level. And I don't mean that no INTP should go for it, but I'll relay the words of my theoretical physics professor (not referring to INTP's specifically), "only do it if you absolutely have to do it". The field is extremely difficult and competitive, only go for career if you would be absolutely miserable otherwise.
 

Duxwing

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Yeah learning physics is fun, I'm talking about working at a professional level. And I don't mean that no INTP should go for it, but I'll relay the words of my theoretical physics professor (not referring to INTP's specifically), "only do it if you absolutely have to do it". The field is extremely difficult and competitive, only go for career if you would be absolutely miserable otherwise.
Therefore, in your view, professional physics is to INTPs as SEAL Team Six is to ISTPs?

-Duxwing
 

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Therefore, in your view, professional physics is to INTPs as SEAL Team Six is to ISTPs?
Something like that, I guess. Physics is simply a hard career. It's mostly populated with INTJ's, ISTJ's and ENTJ's. Extraordinarily competitive and careerist. You'll spend more energy on "being visible" than doing physics, because frankly there's not a lot of new physics problems to go around. I am grateful - practically daily - that I switched careers into programming.

It's odd because Einstein - our prototypical poster child - was a physicist. But he didn't have a career at it. He did all his work as a clerk, then retired to IAS.
 

Duxwing

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Something like that, I guess. Physics is simply a hard career. It's mostly populated with INTJ's, ISTJ's and ENTJ's. Extraordinarily competitive and careerist. You'll spend more energy on "being visible" than doing physics, because frankly there's not a lot of new physics problems to go around. I am grateful - practically daily - that I switched careers into programming.
Wow. That's rough. :( The field may change because plenty of new physics questions may arise if the newly-discovered Higgs Boson badly meshes with the Standard Model.

It's odd because Einstein - our prototypical poster child - was a physicist. But he didn't have a career at it. He did all his work as a clerk, then retired to IAS.
Einstein is... different.

-Duxwing
 

praisetehsun

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Thanks for the help. (first time ever asking something on a forum). Physics is fun, but maybe not at a professional level. what makes computer science a nice choice for intps? ( to any intp who has done it)
 

Blarraun

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There is a thread that portrays interesting qualities of INTP and programming as one of them.
You could find many ideas, answers, views and ask questions there.

Generally, anything that has to do with design and abstraction rather than specifics. Where your big picture matters and goes well with analysis and problem-solving.
 

Ex-User (8886)

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Neuroscience is very interesting, but like physics, it's better for intj.
 
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I have considered... architecture because I can be creative without actually having to work out all the practicalities...
...Limiting, hard to find work, most end up designing parking lots
As a licensed architect (buildings) in a previous life, I can validate what Architect has stated. The only way the flaws of the architectural profession can be overcome is by being in possession of a generous financial inheritance and/or having some personal connection to a wealthy developer/ real estate tycoon/ banker uncle or something of the nepotism sort. That said, there are some rare, unique INTP personalities out there in the profession who I've come across who seem to weather the shit storm that is the architectural profession and still enjoy the ride. To me I had had enough by 1/3 my life to do whatever it would take to get the hell out of it.

In theory and at a distance, architecture (buildings) itself appears massively romantic. If it wasn't for the even more massive ignorance/ ego/ impulsiveness of clients, the public and most architects themselves it just might be. In practice (since only a very very small percentage of actual effort is spent on a given building project and an even smaller amount of that small amount of effort on creativity), its a horrible profession for at least 10 big reasons. Don't let it suck you in in your impressionable 20s by the perceived glamour the schools* and magazines try and marinate it in. 99.9% of architects do not have clients like the types whose projects fill the glossy centerfolds and sexy home pages (specifically the AIA's)...if they have any clients at all.

*the profession is already oversaturated with graduates by a factor of about 4. Since the universities are all funded by debt, student loan debt no less, they don't care about employment after the fact, they just need as many warm bodies in the door each year in order to maintain the facade of relevancy.

Anyways, my second career is physican. Being an architect wasn't a total waste. I know it opened a lot of doors along the way. Took a little while and a ton of effort to pretty much completely reinvent my formal education, but I'm enjoying this second life much more. Always plenty of interesting problems to try and understand/ solve. People/ patients are generally nice to me as well which is priceless. As long as you can manage your accountants and stay out of reach of the lawyers and MBAs there is pretty much carte blanche freedom, too.

If the INTP is smart enough (average minimum IQ of medical doctor is 125) I would recommend physician hands down. But personally, I have slice of INTJ (which dominates the INTP procrastinator as needed) in me so maybe not...
 

WALKYRIA

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Anyways, my second career is physican. Being an architect wasn't a total waste. I know it opened a lot of doors along the way. Took a little while and a ton of effort to pretty much completely reinvent my formal education, but I'm enjoying this second life much more.
Oh really? How old are you now? MEd school is long... and what do you do? GP? specialist? surgeon?

IN retrospect, I don't think pure medicine(Gp, physicians, surgeons!) is a great career for INTPs.... Sure we can practice for few years(job satisfaction=mediocre= 6-7/10) , but a life long carreer? Don't know...

If I were a young INTP I'll only go in medicine if :

-I'm interested in psychology, neurosciences, social sciences or philosophy-- But I want to have a better salary and more job security/respect than a psychologist/social scientist or philosopher(That Implies I'm initially informed enough/ aware of the monetary and fundamental disparities between psychiatrist and psychologist) -- So I'll go into psychiatry!).

-I want to be a medical researcher( MD-Phd) and I am naive enough to believe I'm gonna get a nobel prize( also; you might note that naivety can help one achieve great things, even perhaps med school-- believe me lol !)

-I want to make relatively great money doing things I moderately love( 6-7/10 on a satisfaction scale! ); It's ok because I can do it part time if I want so and still make six figures... and anyways, I know that "to love" is a meaningless, abstract word invented by NFs.. so whatever, I'll go for the money and learn to love my job later eventually.


Other than that I wouldn't go in Med school--since it's not as easy as the young INTP would initially think-- , med school journey/medical culture is just too draining and too stressful for us sensitive INTPs. Sure, internal growth ( we seek that !) and job security is ensured at the end of the journey, but is it worthy? That's a personal matter I guess !

I chose medicine because I had no better choice at that moment... If philosophers/ social scientists had more respect and made 6 figures salary (and there goes my Fe), I would have done that for sure.

Studies have demonstrated that med school is in majority suited for ISTJ memorizers and rule abiders. Other studies have also shown that med school teaching system/medical culture strongly favored extroverts and judders/assertiveness. SO yeah, we have basically nothing to do there... since medicine is for action oriented people.

https://chronicle.com/article/Screening-Out-the-Introverts/131520/

http://www.futurity.org/do-med-school-interviews-favor-extroverts/


It seems that a general INTP consensus is being established here: INTP best jobs would be-- in regard to current economy-- neuroscience/ neuroscience researcher and programming.

One cool thing about programming seems to be the flexibility of the job...
 
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...How old are you now? MEd school is long...
I'm no spring chicken. Probably have 2-3 decades on the average poster/ whippersnapper on this forum. The average age of med students has been rising consistently the last several years. Most of the increase in average age is being driven by "non-traditional" enrollees who are entering second careers in their 30s and sometimes 40s. Its not unheard of for someone in their 50s to enter medical school these days.

Its not that long...for most graduates, med school itself in the U.S. is over at 26 years old on average. + a few years in a residency: not that big of a deal. Besides, as the baby boomers have defined a new paradigm wherein 70 is the new 50: a youthful rosy cheeked doc isn't taken seriously in the marketplace anyways so might as well get out as a still relatively young doc (but not too young) in the mid 30s.

Other than that I wouldn't go in Med school--since it's not as easy as the young INTP would initially think-- , med school journey/medical culture is just too draining and too stressful for us sensitive INTPs.
I would agree with you here (i.e. perhaps only a certain strain of INTP is going to be capable of hacking through the misery). Incidentally I'm hoping by 'sensitive' you mean intellectually sensitive and not the horrid sort of rats nest of sensitive that is the mind of the Feelers.

I chose medicine because I had no better choice at that moment... If philosophers/ social scientists had more respect and made 6 figures salary (and there goes my Fe), I would have done that for sure.
If you are in the U.S. (cannot recall if it was you or another who was posting from their experience in Europe) you can be an MD, make six figures (x2) and still be a philosopher.

As I eluded to in my earlier post, the largest impediment to an INTP blissfully practicing medicine these days are the armies of lawyers, accountants, insurance salesmen and MBAs who continue to parasitize deeper into the territory of the highest quality practice at the expense of an individual patient's particular problem. Their myriad layers of bureaucracy are mind blowing. Even more mind blowing is the growth of these parasites is only poised to continue to exponentially infest. It really is one huge distracting TUMOR growing completely out of control. Gregory House is a fictional character but the situations he is put into are often very real. Anyways...

another option for the INTP who wants to practice some sort of health care/ medicine less so much influence of the axis of evil (lawyers, MBAs, accountants) is dental medicine. So, to the OP and/or anyone else listening in, I'd also recommend looking into other health care career options including dentistry. Dentistry is still pretty much out of the reach of all those nasty things which would otherwise bother the hell out of the INTP physician.

Studies have demonstrated that med school is in majority suited for ISTJ memorizers and rule abiders. Other studies have also shown that med school teaching system/medical culture strongly favored extroverts and judders/assertiveness. SO yeah, we have basically nothing to do there... since medicine is for action oriented people.
I don't have time to look them up right now, but there are authoritative research studies (available on the internet) of the MBTIs of med students and graduates and you are generally correct. But, if my memory serves (and I did research this years ago before jumping in) there are still a fairly large representation (certainly statistically relevant) of introverts as well (something on the order of 40%).

I agree with you and the statement that "med school is in majority suited for ISTJ memorizers and rule abiders...". However, med school is not real life and once it is survived a vastly different world awaits (in many cases the introverted/ rule breakers/ abstract thinkers make the greater impact/ contribution to practice).

Certainly medical school is tough, not going to lie. But it can be survived. ISTJs are probably favored and INTPs the least favored. The biggest challenge isn't so much the overt difficulty of the material (though its not all exactly calculus a small portion does require extra intense concentration/ effort to understand); its the AMOUNT/ VOLUME that is required to be mentally digested in such ungodly short amounts of time.

I calculated once that we were completing something like a 4 credit undergraduate science course every 2 weeks. For four years nonstop.

But it can be done. I took notes on how to mentally cope from sources like navy seal training manuals (and followed up by implementing them). Strategies like "take every hour one hour at a time", "only positive self talk", specific daily goal setting etc..
 

WALKYRIA

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Don't know about you, but I didnt think the theoretical part of med school was hard... just boring. The hard and most irritating ( since I'm a sensitive INTP 5w4 with zero coping skills !) part was the practical part( demands good shadow functions such as Se, good Te) during rotations when you need to perform/ and learn how to do rectal exams, gynecology, urology, draw blood, puncture of ascites, medullary punction, multiple menial bullshit things, act as a slave for other older doctors, think fast... do the practicalities was.. I find it hard, coz I hate to do menial jobs.
Other things I think are really hard:
- Med school is fucking time consuming; you become a slave of med school and I hate that.
-Med students tend to be the type A studnts; they only speak about medecine. Philosophy? "shut up, I don't care". Physics? "shut the fuck up and do your damn job". Theories? "Please sht up, u crazy mofo."
-Therefore I still feel like an Alien... socially disconnected and kinda isolated(it's actually auto-isolation !)!

Maybe it is easier when you already know/experienced about the intrinsic and implicit rules of work environements(to survive the clinical rotations !), coz I hate to work in a stressful environement filled with loads of crowds.
I can't wait to finish thiz shit rotation year !



I'm happy when I see mature, balanced and succesfull INTP people( perhaps you are the more serious INTP 5w6? ). It gives hope.
and yeah, I'm in Europe. I live in the capital city of Europe.


PS: I'd love to PM you so that we could exchange some more infos; I'm curious to know about your current lifestyle(and thus my future lifestyle) as a doctor. Workload; job satisfaction; work-life balance; medical congress; intellectual life; travels,..Etc
 
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