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INTP vs ISTP

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So as a sort of shoot-off from the Relax thread, I have a few questions. I know very little about MBTI, especially compared to folks here on this forum, so I was hoping that y'all could help me understand a couple of things.

What are major differences between the INTP and ISTP personalities? Though I have tested as an INTP multiples times in the past, I was looking into the ISTP and while I found some traits to fit me, others did not (which, of course, could be the case about most of the personality types.

For instance, the ISTP profiles that I read said that ISTPs tend to be interested in expensive things like cars-- I am not at all. I drive an 2004 Toyota with a hole in the bumper and I'm okay with that. It gets me from point A to point B with good gas mileage and that's all I need.

Also, one of the profiles said, "In contrast to INTPs, who sport high levels of mental energy, ISTPs exhibit high levels of physical energy and stamina. While INTPs use their Ne to explore ideas, ISTPs, like ISFPs, use their hands, body, and other senses to explore and manipulate the concrete world (Se)." In reference to this quote, I am definitely an INTP. I enjoy physical hobbies like hiking and camping, but I am much more cerebral in my daily life than I am physical. I was never really into sports growing up because I have terrible coordination and I prefer to explore with my mind over my hands.

I am not a kinesthetic learner, I learn best from the written word and visual diagrams. I also have very little mechanical skill and struggle to put together IKEA bookshelves (sad but true). Sometimes things go very well, other times they crash and burn. I'm just not mechanically inclined. I failed wood shop in high school because I literally broke the table saw. Apparently, this is NOT an ISTP kind of thing to do.

Also, I have never in my life been described as narcissistic and I shy away from competition (though not from debates or challenges-- I just have no desire to be "first place" in some contrived contest).

But then the things I have in common-- I am quick to question authority and any rules that I don't personally see a need for, I enjoy the adrenaline rush of fairly intense recreational activities like caving and mountain climbing, I am often seen by others as genuinely kind and optimistic, I love solving problems and coming up with a really great solution, I am incredibly independent (though I am very strongly bonded to a handful of family members), I am fiercely loyal, and I am very agreeable and "to each their own" until someone attacks me, at which point I tend to turn combative very quickly (in my attitude, not physically).

I understand if any of this isn't interesting to folks, but if it is, I'd really appreciate your feedback about any marked differences between the two personalities. Thanks :)
 

redbaron

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The things that you list in common are mostly related to the Ti-Fe Dominant/Inferior pairing. It isn't too hard to find similarities between the two because of that relationship.

Differences lie in the Ne-Si vs. Se-Ni pairing, and the dominance of N over S - which as you've already outlined most often manifests in whether you're more cerebral or action-oriented.

So basically yes, assuming you're an INTP you'll find there are actually many things shared in common with an ISTP because of the Ti-Fe axiom.
 
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The things that you list in common are mostly related to the Ti-Fe Dominant/Inferior pairing. It isn't too hard to find similarities between the two because of that relationship.

Differences lie in the Ne-Si vs. Se-Ni pairing, and the dominance of N over S - which as you've already outlined most often manifests in whether you're more cerebral or action-oriented.

So basically yes, assuming you're an INTP you'll find there are actually many things shared in common with an ISTP because of the Ti-Fe axiom.
Gotcha, so the primary difference is preferring the cerebral instead of the physical? In that case, I would remain firmly an INTP. I do not prefer being "hands on".
 

walfin

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Gotcha, so the primary difference is preferring the cerebral instead of the physical? In that case, I would remain firmly an INTP. I do not prefer being "hands on".
Sensors are more down-to-earth people, who generally (at least I think so) prefer not to divorce theory and practice.

The way I see it, INTPs can debate theory in a mental vacuum and apply it to practice afterwards. For the S-types, theory and practice are fused. The abstract principle does not operate on a higher plane. I don't know how to describe this but it would be apparent in conversation.
 

Jennywocky

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Sensors are more down-to-earth people, who generally (at least I think so) prefer not to divorce theory and practice.

The way I see it, INTPs can debate theory in a mental vacuum and apply it to practice afterwards. For the S-types, theory and practice are fused. The abstract principle does not operate on a higher plane. I don't know how to describe this but it would be apparent in conversation.
Yes, and in the kinds of disagreements I've observed. The ISTPs I know are quite capable of dissecting arguments but usually on a more practical and pragmatic basis vs the INTP seemingly esoteric one. There's a "down to earthness" about the logic and not wanting to waste lots of time on what amounts to irrelevant discussion in terms of accomplishing the goal at hand.

Put another way, when INTPs start discussing an issue, expect it to get abstracted and indulged in for the sake of the topic, without necessarily a tie-in back to solving the problem; the ISTPs are more likely to focus on a solution that can be applied and not waste time with the extras and the philosophical arguments.
 
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Sensors are more down-to-earth people, who generally (at least I think so) prefer not to divorce theory and practice.

The way I see it, INTPs can debate theory in a mental vacuum and apply it to practice afterwards. For the S-types, theory and practice are fused. The abstract principle does not operate on a higher plane. I don't know how to describe this but it would be apparent in conversation.
Yes, and in the kinds of disagreements I've observed. The ISTPs I know are quite capable of dissecting arguments but usually on a more practical and pragmatic basis vs the INTP seemingly esoteric one. There's a "down to earthness" about the logic and not wanting to waste lots of time on what amounts to irrelevant discussion in terms of accomplishing the goal at hand.

Put another way, when INTPs start discussing an issue, expect it to get abstracted and indulged in for the sake of the topic, without necessarily a tie-in back to solving the problem; the ISTPs are more likely to focus on a solution that can be applied and not waste time with the extras and the philosophical arguments.
Hm interesting, okay. That's an interesting division and one that I'm not sure which side I'm on. I like discussing how a specific thing works, but that's because I taught for a few years and I have a passion for spreading knowledge. I can be very solution-focused and I attribute that to my years with the Air Force. We had to memorize those "decision making cycle" formulas and clearly go through each step in it, else we were heavily criticized for sloppy problem-solving skills. I wanted to succeed and be a good officer, so I adapted my "sloppy" process into their solution-focused one.

On the other hand, when I discuss politics, I generally speak in the abstract. I like presenting concrete facts to support my position, but I hate...gosh, what would the word be...I hate confining my ideas to specifics. I feel like it cheapens them and makes it seem like they're less than they are. Does that make any sense? I'm sorry if I'm rambling a bit.

I have a habit of playing devil's advocate, simply to explore the opposing position, which drives my husband insane, though he'll generally still indulge me haha :) I just love debate for the sake of debate. Exploring a new perspective is interesting-- I feel like it's learning a pathway in my brain that I hadn't used before.

Now I know I'm rambling :) I'm just kind of interested in learning about myself, so typology really interests me. Thank you for the help, I really appreciate it.
 

Cherry Cola

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What do you talk to people about and what do you prefer to talk to people about? Or perhaps more importantly, if you talk to someone for a longer period of time, say 10 minutes to an hour, where does the conversation go? And where do you want it to go?

Does it stay down to earth and focused on a subject? Or does it go all over the place in abstract speculation?
 
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What do you talk to people about and what do you prefer to talk to people about? Or perhaps more importantly, if you talk to someone for a longer period of time, say 10 minutes to an hour, where does the conversation go? And where do you want it to go?

Does it stay down to earth and focused on a subject? Or does it go all over the place in abstract speculation?
Lol all over the place. My family and friends have always kind of teased me about that. They've called me scatterbrained and an airhead quite a lot. I'm just not very good at staying focused-- the way that I describe it is I have several different "clouds" of thought going on at once. It's easy for me to bounce from one to another because I see my own connection between them, but other folks get a little disoriented by the quick, numerous transitions. So I've really started trying to articulate my transitions as I make them so that folks stay with me in the conversation.
 

Absurdity

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These discussions always fall prey to confirmation bias and aren't usually very constructive. The stigma against being a sensor on this forum (and elsewhere) makes people look for evidence that would suggest that they are intuitive while disregarding any evidence of sensor-hood.

Take it with a grain of salt, but you don't strike me as an INTP. Part of it could be that another type fits and something makes you subconsciously reluctant to admit it. The other part could just be that the 16 types are limiting generalizations and some people are bound to not fit perfectly.

I don't even see myself as a very orthodox INTP, and I have stopped trying to be one because it's not "who I am."
 
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These discussions always fall prey to confirmation bias and aren't usually very constructive. The stigma against being a sensor on this forum (and elsewhere) makes people look for evidence that would suggest that they are intuitive while disregarding any evidence of sensor-hood.

Take it with a grain of salt, but you don't strike me as an INTP. Part of it could be that another type fits and something makes you subconsciously reluctant to admit it. The other part could just be that the 16 types are limiting generalizations and some people are bound to not fit perfectly.

I don't even see myself as a very orthodox INTP, and I have stopped trying to be one because it's not "who I am."
I was thinking the same, honestly-- if I read every personality type, I'm sure that I could find some things that agreed with me and others that didn't. I'm trying be as objective as possible-- hence why I said that some traits do align with my personality, such as a love for processes.

I'll be honest, I'm not trying to fit into any personality type, I'm simply trying to learn more about myself. That sounds conceited, but I just mean that I'm interested in introspection. When my husband read the INTP description, he legitimately laughed and said, "Wow, that's so you." I use him as a sounding board for a lot of my self-assessments because he'll tell me if I'm tending towards what I WANT to be rather than what I am.

I also think that societal factors can heavily influence individuals so that while they may still be a particular personality type, many of the identifying traits may have been quieted or discouraged and instead, they may have been encouraged to develop their weaker qualities. For instance, my husband (as I know him) is a classic xSFJ. He cries at sad movies, he communicates by voicing his emotions, he's very "hands on" and active, etc. But he was raised to believe that men shouldn't show excess emotion, so it took me a while to get through the "modified" self into his true personality. Does that make sense? I'm sorry if I'm explaining myself badly-- I'm not always good at articulating my points.

I think that being an American female, one is generally encouraged to be SF, not NT. I was bullied relentlessly and put through ten (I know it's excessive) different schools in K-12 because of reoccurring bullying issues. After a while, I got tired of it and adapted. I lost weight, learned how to dress stylishly, and forced myself to develop a friendly, more "feminine" ethos. That said, at the core, I am still very much myself-- hence why my husband read the NT (particularly the INTP) description and laughed, saying that I was very much like it. But I learned how to function a little less awkwardly and develop a few hobbies that people would actually share with me.

Sorry for the long-winded explanation. I guess what I'm trying to say is that I do believe that I'm an INTP, largely because it's what I have repeatedly tested as, but also because the description reads pretty true, but I think that I have adapted my interpersonal self to be "less NT-ish".

Or I could be rationalizing to try and fit myself into the INTP mold :) I have to concede that possibility-- but I really am trying to be entirely honest. What would I gain from mistyping myself? I'm simply trying to learn more about how I think and function. I think it's really interesting.
 

Architect

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My brother is an ISTP and I work with a bunch so I've learned a few things about them. Mainly they differ from INTPs in

o INTPs live in theory, ISTPs live more in reality. They both are thinkers but ISTP's don't love abstraction the way INTP's do. Oftentimes they are dismissive to it in their quest to actually get something done. This implies that INTP's are often armchair philosophers who never accomplish anything useful which is true also.

o ISTP's are much more physically oriented than INTP's. ISTP's will be out rollerblading, skiing or climbing a mountain while INTP's are the brain on the table connected to a computer.

o Generally, but not always, ISTP's are more mechanically oriented compared to the INTP theory orientation.
 

Cherry Cola

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These discussions always fall prey to confirmation bias and aren't usually very constructive. The stigma against being a sensor on this forum (and elsewhere) makes people look for evidence that would suggest that they are intuitive while disregarding any evidence of sensor-hood.
Kats a pretty good example of someone who doesnt care that much about the stigma though, she seems to have enough of a confidence not to be bothered, and at the same time enough brains to realize that regardless of whether your an N or an S in MBTI terms you're still the same you. Which is why I don't mind asking so directly and obviously.

That being said I can't figure you out Kat, you don't strike me as an INTP but you don't particularly strike me as any other type either, your extraverted function is clearly percieving though (your last answer points to it, also I got the impression before), and you seem an introvert. Closure still needed on S or N and F or T though.

Could you specify the typical contents of your leisurely conversations with friends a little bit more? Assuming an N conversant do you go abstract and build haphazard ivory towers spontaneously together?

Also how do you feel about politics and morals? What do you hate what do you like and why?

Sorry if I'm being probing I just can't figure some people out without poking them for info.
 
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My brother is an ISTP and I work with a bunch so I've learned a few things about them. Mainly they differ from INTPs in

o INTPs live in theory, ISTPs live more in reality. They both are thinkers but ISTP's don't love abstraction the way INTP's do. Oftentimes they are dismissive to it in their quest to actually get something done. This implies that INTP's are often armchair philosophers who never accomplish anything useful which is true also.

o ISTP's are much more physically oriented than INTP's. ISTP's will be out rollerblading, skiing or climbing a mountain while INTP's are the brain on the table connected to a computer.

o Generally, but not always, ISTP's are more mechanically oriented compared to the INTP theory orientation.
Hm. I don't feel like I fit either of the initial descriptions, honestly. I philosophize and theorize a LOT, but then I want to go apply it and plan to work through it. For instance, I'll read a lot about a process or theory, then I want to go "apply" it by teaching it to someone else and having a conversation about it. I love abstraction and creative thought, but I also love applying it to what I already know and linking concepts together.

I prefer mental stimulation to physical activity, but I still really enjoy physical activity when I do it. I'll be out climbing a mountain while I think about the various ecological webs that I'm passing by, how the mountain formed, how the sun's energy is being absorbed into the rock face and reradiated, etc.

I'm great at grasping concepts, but I have very little mechanical (practical haha) ability. For instance, on the AFOQT (aptitude test for the Air Force), I scored 98 on spatial awareness (we had to do three-dimensional block estimations and plane orientations based on instruments and views out of the cockpit), but I get lost CONSTANTLY. I once emailed my husband while he was deployed and asked him to help walk me through finding my way home when I was lost lol. Embarrassing, but true.

Kats a pretty good example of someone who doesnt care that much about the stigma though, she seems to have enough of a confidence not to be bothered, and at the same time enough brains to realize that regardless of whether your an N or an S in MBTI terms you're still the same you. Which is why I don't mind asking so directly and obviously.

That being said I can't figure you out Kat, you don't strike me as an INTP but you don't particularly strike me as any other type either, your extraverted function is clearly percieving though (your last answer points to it, also I got the impression before), and you seem an introvert. Closure still needed on S or N and F or T though.

Could you specify the typical contents of your leisurely conversations with friends a little bit more? Assuming an N conversant do you go abstract and build haphazard ivory towers spontaneously together?

Also how do you feel about politics and morals? What do you hate what do you like and why?

Sorry if I'm being probing I just can't figure some people out without poking them for info.
Thank you for that :) Yes, being an N or an S doesn't make me more or less intelligent-- if that were the case, I'd shirk the label altogether and just go it on my own. For the most part, I'm very comfortable in my own skin at this point. I just like learning more about myself over time and typology seems like a great way to open some doors that I hadn't looked at before.

Hm, conversations with friends can go a few different ways. Typically, I'll cater to whatever their interest is-- I've tried to discuss some of my more obscure interests in the past and folks generally aren't interested, so I changed my tactics. I do tend to be solution-based when my friends or family complain. If there's a problem at work, a problem with the relatives, etc., my reaction is almost never :hugs :hugs I'm sorry, that sucks! I generally say, "Okay, well what's going on here and here? Did they sign a lease? Is that against the regulations? Well then you can respond by doing this and this and it'll correct the problem. Here are links for the workplace regulations at your location: [insertlinkhere]." I genuinely want to help them, so it's not that I'm not sympathetic. I just don't see "That sucks!" as particularly helpful and I really do want to help them out.

Politics and morals, I'm all over the place. I'm a Christian, but I am also very Libertarian, so I support free will as long as it doesn't interfere with other people or trespass on their rights. I am pro-gay marriage for that reason (I also actually think that homosexuality is not sinful, but that goes into biblical interpretation, so I won't expand on that unless asked). Also, I am very pro-national defense (I imagine this is because both of my grandfathers were military, my parents were both Air Force officers, and I went through four years of Air Force ROTC) and EXTREMELY pro-education. I actually believe that public education (including university) should be completely free of charge for legal American citizens, because I think that education is such an elixir for society. I think that education can only improve upon things and can only very, very rarely cause harm.

I hate unnecessary cruelty and greed. I hate people who intentionally harm others when they could choose to do otherwise. I hate bigotry and ignorance. I hate the -isms. Racism, sexism, etc. I hate leeches-- people who suck money out of the system without contributing anything back to it. Either live on your own and don't contribute, or depend on the system while giving back to it. You can't have your cake and eat it too. I hate competition and pissing contests. I don't really care that people are smarter, stronger, faster, and more successful than I am-- I truly don't seek out comparisons. But I do get very frustrated when people contact me just to compare themselves to me. For instance, my family contacting me to tell me that my cousin's child is walking earlier/talking more/etc. I just...I don't care for it. My daughter is wonderful and she is developing at her own pace and I really don't want to have competition forced upon me and thrust in my face time and time again.

I like selflessness and generosity. I like intelligence and acceptance. I like genuine love of our neighbors while respecting their privacy and not needing to be in each other's faces. For instance, I'd like to speak to my neighbor (who I am friends with) twice or thrice a week at very most, but if she needs something (like for me to watch her daughter), she is more than welcome to contact me at any time and ask. I love giving to people and helping them. I love buying food for homeless people and talking to them about how their day has been going so far. I love serving people. But I also love my own autonomy-- I like to be able to retreat into myself and read and research and have alone time. I like the feeling of independence and not needing anyone-- I crave self-sufficiency. I love the outdoors. I love fresh air and sunshine and the feeling of doing something fun just for the hell of it. I love creativity and adventure and fantasy. I LOVE imagination and exploration. I love creative writing, though I often don't have the patience to write down my thoughts.

This is incredibly long, I'm sorry! I'll truncate it here. I tried to answer your questions, though-- I hope that I managed to! And again, sorry for the excessive length.
 

Cherry Cola

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I dunno about that E, couldnt it just be the friendly open tone online? :P

You seem an INFJ to me.

-High degree of self consciousness (pro national defense but no problem attributing it to past events)
-Desiring harmony and genuinity
-Physical stimuli evoking theorizing (seeing the mountain thinking about its formation process etc)
-Finding great satisfaction in extraverting feeling (the way you've described talking to people by asking them questions and helping them, the whole give and take philosophy of everyone helping on another out)

But you've also shown a bunch of P traits. Possibly because INFJ's are dominant percievers after all, despite extraverting judgement through auxillary Fe.

You seem to combine the detached analyzer with the people person, and thats INFJ not INFP who's analyzis isn't detached what with them being introverted judgers.

Those are my two cents atm :P But I should think this over a bit and read more of your posts tbh. For one I'm not so sure about you having inferior extraverted sensing, which you would as an INFJ.
 

pariahmariah

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Something else to think about, Kat and others, is not just WHAT someone does, but also WHY they do it. Two people can engage in conversations for completely different reasons.

For example, when I start conversations with strangers, its for a very very specific reason...like a social experiment that will give me insight into a specific problem I'm trying to solve. I'm very rarely looking to connect with people for fun. The fun is always in my head. I haven't had the luxury of running across anyone who enjoys abstract thinking as much as I do.

On the other hand, I have a friend who calls me at least once a week inviting me to come over to her place for drinks with other friends, to play cards, and to watch movies...all in the same night! There is no way in hell I'd be able to withstand that level of interacting. Now if she called to let me know we were getting together to discuss business or personal growth, is be all over it. It just can't be thoughtless banter. I would die a slow and painful death.
 

Cherry Cola

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I know it looks lime I'm just collecting data and going by pinpointers but I'm really trying to form a picture of the how you mention, I promise! What is useless on its own since people don't live in exactly the same place with exactly the same culture etc.
 
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for what it's worth you come across as ExxP to me kats
I appreciate your input! I do think that I am introverted, though. I like talking to folks online, but in limited doses. And in person, I get worn out and awkward pretty often. I don't really require much interaction with people-- my daughter and husband are more than enough 95% of the time.

I dunno about that E, couldnt it just be the friendly open tone online? :P

You seem an INFJ to me.

-High degree of self consciousness (pro national defense but no problem attributing it to past events)
-Desiring harmony and genuinity
-Physical stimuli evoking theorizing (seeing the mountain thinking about its formation process etc)
-Finding great satisfaction in extraverting feeling (the way you've described talking to people by asking them questions and helping them, the whole give and take philosophy of everyone helping on another out)

But you've also shown a bunch of P traits. Possibly because INFJ's are dominant percievers after all, despite extraverting judgement through auxillary Fe.

You seem to combine the detached analyzer with the people person, and thats INFJ not INFP who's analyzis isn't detached what with them being introverted judgers.

Those are my two cents atm :P But I should think this over a bit and read more of your posts tbh. For one I'm not so sure about you having inferior extraverted sensing, which you would as an INFJ.
Interesting, okay. See, I wouldn't peg myself as an F, not because I lack emotion ( I actually can feel things very strongly sometimes), but because I trust thought much more than emotion. I also struggle very much to communicate emotions, even to my husband. It's much easier for me to explain things analytically. But then I'm also a firm humanitarian, which I imagine shows a strong lean towards F. I also love working with animals (I volunteered at the Human Society in my area for 4 years in college) because they're kind and companionable.

It's funny being called a people person, because I think that's the first time that I've ever heard myself described as that. I care a lot about people, but I don't always get along with them very well. I have little patience for tact and a tendency towards bluntness, as long as I remain professional. I desire competence and have a strong disdain for incompetent coworkers. I also tend not to give "feel good" feedback and instead give honest advice. I may try and say it kindly, I may not, depending on my liking for the person (that sounds terrible, but it's honest), but either way, I'm going to be honest.

Detached analyzer describes me to a T. It's strange but fun describing myself-- it's not something that I do very often, but I enjoy pulling myself apart and looking at the pieces and individual traits and tendencies. Thank you for talking to me about this :)
 

Brontosaurie

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I appreciate your input! I do think that I am introverted, though. I like talking to folks online, but in limited doses. And in person, I get worn out and awkward pretty often. I don't really require much interaction with people-- my daughter and husband are more than enough 95% of the time.
i see.

the ENxP loner for example isn't unheard of, though. it is possible to have an extraverted function as lead while still being quite reserved or distant or happy with a narrow array of interaction. at least if you lead with a perceiving function. the ExxJ's are far more attracted to social prestige than the ExxP's and thus less likely to be content with familiar surroundings.

source: none
 

HDINTP

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I am not a kinesthetic learner, I learn best from the written word and visual diagrams. I also have very little mechanical skill and struggle to put together IKEA bookshelves (sad but true). Sometimes things go very well, other times they crash and burn. I'm just not mechanically inclined. I failed wood shop in high school because I literally broke the table saw. Apparently, this is NOT an ISTP kind of thing to do.
Trust me I know what you are talking about and when I imagine that my father is ISTP... Plus you are a woman aren't you? So it is allright but I am supposed to be a man:confused:.
 
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Something else to think about, Kat and others, is not just WHAT someone does, but also WHY they do it. Two people can engage in conversations for completely different reasons.

For example, when I start conversations with strangers, its for a very very specific reason...like a social experiment that will give me insight into a specific problem I'm trying to solve. I'm very rarely looking to connect with people for fun. The fun is always in my head. I haven't had the luxury of running across anyone who enjoys abstract thinking as much as I do.

On the other hand, I have a friend who calls me at least once a week inviting me to come over to her place for drinks with other friends, to play cards, and to watch movies...all in the same night! There is no way in hell I'd be able to withstand that level of interacting. Now if she called to let me know we were getting together to discuss business or personal growth, is be all over it. It just can't be thoughtless banter. I would die a slow and painful death.
This is very true. I'm very similar to you in that respect-- I talk to someone because I'm interested in something specific or because I want to bring something up. In other words, I talk to someone when I have something to say; I don't just talk for the sake of socializing. And yeah, folks are rarely interested in the erm...lofty? Obscure? Random? Things that I'm interested in, so I tend to keep those in my pocket until I find someone who actually wants to talk about them.

Oh gosh, that's intense lol. I could go to the night and then not see them for like three weeks, or I could go for part of it and then see them again in a week or so. The banter stuff would kill me-- I'd have to lock onto something both relevant and marginally interesting, like thematic elements of the movie or something.

I know it looks lime I'm just collecting data and going by pinpointers but I'm really trying to form a picture of the how you mention, I promise! What is useless on its own since people don't live in exactly the same place with exactly the same culture etc.
Oh, no way, I appreciate all discussion and feedback! :) I've lived in quite a few places, but the culture within my family demanded that everyone be outspoken, misanthropic, down to Earth, and practical. I am often the first and sometimes the last, but I am not a misanthrope and I'm definitely the most "head in the clouds" person of my family. I guess I went against the grain a bit, but I'm sure that I was heavily influenced by my upbringing.
 

BloodCountess88

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From the posts you've written, you strike me as a very confrontational person. Just another thought on the topic :confused:. From my understanding Introverted Thinkers are non confrontational (both INTP and ISTP's), wouldn't call people out on things, would just really not care/shrug it off. Extroverted thinkers, on the other hand, tend to be confrontational. And they tend to jump from idea to idea, in a broader scale so (someone correct me if I am wrong) but topics are a lot less in depth, more fluent and transitioning from topic to topic is organic.


Now, I'm an INTP who has been trying to develop my sensing. Specially regarding sports and body movement. It doesn't come naturally to me, I have to FORCE myself to do such. So physically, an ISTP and an INTP do (or might) look very different.

I suspect my son is an ISTP. While both my children are severely withdrawn, my son is very organized and clean, extremely strong and interested in movement (he looks like it too, low body fat large muscle mass already), dislikes strong display of emotion (doesn't get along with ENFP father, for example, cries every time he tells a story because of his voice/tone/enthusiasm) and is the example of a kinesthetic learner, although he has a photographic memory (based on the recent testing we did) he seems to be really interested in building/recreating and patterns.

ISTP is honestly one of those personality types that I find extremely interesting. It seems to me that there are distinct explicit behavioral patterns between the two, one being rigidity on external display of control and order.
 
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i see.

the ENxP loner for example isn't unheard of, though. it is possible to have an extraverted function as lead while still being quite reserved or distant or happy with a narrow array of interaction. at least if you lead with a perceiving function. the ExxJ's are far more attracted to social prestige than the ExxP's and thus less likely to be content with familiar surroundings.

source: none
Huh. See, I always thought of an introvert as someone who lost energy from social interaction and an extrovert as someone who becomes energized by social interaction. By that definition, I am an introvert-- socializing really wears me out. If there are Es who lose energy from social interaction and don't greatly enjoy it, then I supposed that it's a possibility.

Trust me I know what you are talking about and when I imagine that my father is ISTP... Plus you are a woman aren't you? So it is allright but I am supposed to be a man:confused:.
I am lol. And yes, not a mechanic by nature at all haha!

From the posts you've written, you strike me as a very confrontational person. Just another thought on the topic :confused:. From my understanding Introverted Thinkers are non confrontational (both INTP and ISTP's), wouldn't call people out on things, would just really not care/shrug it off. Extroverted thinkers, on the other hand, tend to be confrontational. And they tend to jump from idea to idea, in a broader scale so (someone correct me if I am wrong) but topics are a lot less in depth, more fluent and transitioning from topic to topic is organic.


Now, I'm an INTP who has been trying to develop my sensing. Specially regarding sports and body movement. It doesn't come naturally to me, I have to FORCE myself to do such. So physically, an ISTP and an INTP do (or might) look very different.

I suspect my son is an ISTP. While both my children are severely withdrawn, my son is very organized and clean, extremely strong and interested in movement (he looks like it too, low body fat large muscle mass already), dislikes strong display of emotion (doesn't get along with ENFP father, for example, cries every time he tells a story because of his voice/tone/enthusiasm) and is the example of a kinesthetic learner, although he has a photographic memory (based on the recent testing we did) he seems to be really interested in building/recreating and patterns.

ISTP is honestly one of those personality types that I find extremely interesting. It seems to me that there are distinct explicit behavioral patterns between the two, one being rigidity on external display of control and order.
I'm confrontational, but I don't enjoy fighting-- if that makes any sense whatsoever :) I don't like tension, anger, or animosity, but I enjoy debate and I see the spread of misinformation as a serious issue. So if I see someone spreading an untruth (particularly in a subject that I care about), I feel the need to correct them. I really have an issue with ignorance and I don't want to perpetuate and enable it by staying silent when I could share instead. I don't ENJOY conflict, but sometimes I see it as necessary.

I go pretty in depth into topics-- for instance, I was reading a bit about immunizations the other day. I saw a term that I didn't understand, so I read up on that. I then saw another term that I didn't understand, so I read up on that. I ended up reading about some of the building blocks of immunology and going into a great deal of detail over the course of a week or so. So I jumped around, but it was all connected for me.

Oh goodness lol. I am not organized or particularly clean. As gross as it sounds, my hygiene is a little sub-par and in my fraternity, I was known as "the girl who had all of the water bottles and crap in the back of her car". My husband was just joking about the water bottles on the way home-- when we met, I had well over 50 water bottles just piled into the foot wells of my car. Same with papers from classes, random articles of clothing, etc. I've always been the "messy kid" in my family. Organization is cool because it's neat to see everything come together, but it's just not something that I'm inclined towards. I have improved my hygiene enough that I look more "normal" (I used to just wear my hair in a bun, tshirt, jeans, sweatshirt 24/7; I also had bad acne, but I started taking care of my face so it cleared up).

I'm also definitely not a kinesthetic learner (I seem to have no muscle memory) and I have a memory that is sporadic at best for day-to-day stuff, though I can remember concepts and academic information pretty well. My daughter is super interested in patterns and sorting, but she's still teeny, so she has years to develop her personality :)
 

Brontosaurie

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Huh. See, I always thought of an introvert as someone who lost energy from social interaction and an extrovert as someone who becomes energized by social interaction. By that definition, I am an introvert-- socializing really wears me out. If there are Es who lose energy from social interaction and don't greatly enjoy it, then I supposed that it's a possibility.
i think it makes sense to distinguish general introversion from functional introversion in the jungian sense.

but i'm not rly a natural when it comes to typing, i don't claim to be certain of your extraversion.
 

Paladin-X

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Just to add some confusion, have you looked at INFP?

There is a lot of value judgment in the way that you describe things:

I hate unnecessary cruelty and greed. I hate people who intentionally harm others when they could choose to do otherwise. I hate bigotry and ignorance. I hate the -isms. Racism, sexism, etc. I hate leeches-- people who suck money out of the system without contributing anything back to it. Either live on your own and don't contribute, or depend on the system while giving back to it. You can't have your cake and eat it too. I hate competition and pissing contests. I don't really care that people are smarter, stronger, faster, and more successful than I am-- I truly don't seek out comparisons. But I do get very frustrated when people contact me just to compare themselves to me. For instance, my family contacting me to tell me that my cousin's child is walking earlier/talking more/etc. I just...I don't care for it. My daughter is wonderful and she is developing at her own pace and I really don't want to have competition forced upon me and thrust in my face time and time again.

I like selflessness and generosity. I like intelligence and acceptance. I like genuine love of our neighbors while respecting their privacy and not needing to be in each other's faces. For instance, I'd like to speak to my neighbor (who I am friends with) twice or thrice a week at very most, but if she needs something (like for me to watch her daughter), she is more than welcome to contact me at any time and ask. I love giving to people and helping them. I love buying food for homeless people and talking to them about how their day has been going so far. I love serving people. But I also love my own autonomy-- I like to be able to retreat into myself and read and research and have alone time. I like the feeling of independence and not needing anyone-- I crave self-sufficiency. I love the outdoors. I love fresh air and sunshine and the feeling of doing something fun just for the hell of it. I love creativity and adventure and fantasy. I LOVE imagination and exploration. I love creative writing, though I often don't have the patience to write down my thoughts.
Just throwing it out there. :)
 

scorpiomover

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MBTI is not about what you do, but HOW you do it.

Sensors are what Jung called "CONCRETISTS". To Jung, Sensors are people who go for the reliable, like what you physically see, hear, small, feel, touch and taste. It also includes anything that you consider as reliable as what you see and sense. That includes the familar, the things that you know well, the practical, conventional consensus, etc. It also includes those ideas that are built on other concrete concepts, that are so solidly connected, as to make the new idea as reliable as the concrete concepts they are built on.

Intuitives have lots of intuitions, those "flashes of inspiration" that one has, when one is working on a problem and answers aren't forthcoming, and one gets this sudden idea out of nowhere, that doesn't seem to be connected to anything in the topic whatsoever, but that, when one tries to understand the problem by assuming that the intuition is true, seems to solve the problem entirely, or at the least, sheds some light on the problem. The fact that the intuition cannot be concretely proved by other concrete concepts, means that it cannot be said to be reliable, and so puts Sensors off from consciously accepting most of their intuitions. But for the intuitive, the reverse is true. They love the idea that they can see a solution where everyone else sees no way to solve the problem. They positively thrive on exploring the possibility of a wholly new idea, even if it turns out to be false.

Sensors also use intuition, but unconsciously. This means that when it comes to doing something, the Sensor will be more likely to use conventional methods, but where they do not fit perfectly, which is the norm, they will make them fit, by using their own adaptations that seem to come from nowhere. Their intutions exist as ideas in their own right, but would be expressed as a Sensor, only as things that may help the concrete idea become a reality.

Intuitives also use Concretism, but unconsciously. They assume the facts upon which they build their ideas, but don't really refer to them as ideas in themselves. They will refer to facts as part of a new idea. But concrete facts themselves are considered as too trivial to refer to as having value in themselves.

In IxTPs, Ne/Se are auxiliary, and so only really show up as aids to the dominant thinking anyway. Even so, the differences between an INTP and an ISTP can be startling. The ISTP works with conventional solutions, using improvisation to get the convention to work. INTPs work with original solutions, using conventionally accepted methods and facts to sort out the holes in their original solutions.

Say, rock-climbing. I've done it before, and I enjoyed it. But a lot of my time was spent studying rock-climbing, how to do it the best, what exactly about rocks makes it so difficult, when it might be useful, etc. I probably spent more time analysing, than I actually did climbing. Once I had a better idea of what to do, I wasn't that keen to continue. Same for exercise. I kind of have to force myself to do it, or I have to use it meditatively, or as a quiet time to think about stuff. Being "in the moment" is not something I find easy to do.

When it comes the the physical, there has to be another reason for doing it.

However, when I'm coding, I am so much in the moment, that I've literally gone through the night, to 10am the next day, before I even considered stopping, and I still wouldn't stop till noon, and then only when I was told to. If it's a mental pursuit, I'm actually content to do it without any particular goal in mind whatsoever, for as long as my body and my mind will hold out. ISTPs could probably do the same. But I imagine that they would at least stop, when it becomes patently obvious that it's not really going to help, while I'll keep going for the mental freebasing, and the pleasure I get from exercising my imagination, even when I really know that if I was sensible, I should be doing something else.
 

h0bby1

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from what i could understand, the S/N function relate to the source of the T/F, ISTP will have analyzing capacity, analyzing what they see, being good at mechanics, about understanding how things they can see work, are lot into experimenting with thing to understand them, because their thinking take source in sensor, so they are very experience oriented

whereas NT type will more have intuition as their source of thinking, so they are more idealistic and tend to be much more on intellectually creative abstract thinking, more into creating system from scratch, designing things on their own without even having to really take example on already existing things, they are more the kind who can pull out theory about a whole brand new system that is completlly novel , and can function without having much of material experimentation to ground their thinking on, where istp will be quite disoriented if they can't see the thing working in front of their eyes
 
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