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Is anyone else failing college (or failed in the past)?

Sabreena

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So. Basically I'm a tiny bit close to being on acadmic probation for having a less than 2.0 GPA.

I can't explain why I'm doing so bad. School is tied up too much with my ego and identity, having grown up being one of the "smart kids" in very small private schools. Now I go to a college with 30,000+ people and you can never stand out here unless you're very proactive.

No motivation. No career path. I'm disillusioned with the school sytem. In high school, though I had procrastination and anxiety, I was able to get through, because I had a concrete goal: make it to graduation, go to college. I read a blog post somewhere that said INSTPs find college easier because there are more N types as professors and you get to pick your own courses or something. That's not the case for me.

I also have social anxiety with a side order of depression. I have a doctor and therapist, but even they measure my improvement in how "well" I'm doing in school.
 

Analyzer

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Yes, I dropped out then taught myself skills to make money and self-educate on my own time.

College/university has essentially been mostly training centers since the early 1900's. It's only really important if you need it as a credential to practice a certain vocation(law,medicine), want some Je recognition, or if just you want to go for the "experience" .
 

Lot

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I failed most of my classes the first semester. Failed one class the second semester. Then had on and off issues until I realized that dropping classes keeps your gpa up.

I eventually dropped out after getting my AA, because my social anxiety and depression got too much to handle. The fact that I didn't know what I wanted to do, and I was thinking about killing myself, made it easier to just quit school. Of course I could have dealt with the root problem, but that would have made too much sense.

College is a whole different game than high school. I had a psychology teacher that never went over in class what would be on the test. He would then post the study guide to a dropbox website, which I had no access to. He didn't care that I was failing, or that his class structure was stupid. He was there to talk about what he wanted to and get a paycheck. I had a history teacher that didn't like my political views, so she would mark me off on tests, and later asked if I was retarded and needed to check into the special needs assistance. She was such a cunt. There was another teacher, philosophy, that was using the campus as a recruiting ground for his christian cult. Which I joined and increased my depression and anxiety. I had more terrible teachers, but I rather not list them all.

That kind of shit never happened in high school. There was some consistency. Teachers cared if I succeeded. Other students where sort of like a support system, which I lost in college, which contributed to my joining of a cult. In high school, you didn't need to be all that self motivated to succeed. where as in college you get nowhere without some sort of motivation.

I'm not going to say you should drop out, but don't think less of yourself for it. If you don't know why you are going for, and have no end game in mind, it might be better off to sit out a few semesters till you get an idea of what you want. Or at least get the general core classes required for every degree, out of the way.

Also get a new therapist. If they aren't helping you, then find someone better. Firing them will be good for your anxiety ;) INTPs seem to have trouble finding therapists that work for them.
 
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INTP here. Yes. The first semester was on academic probation.

Then, the next semester I went all out 110% and focused like a laser on doing everything to get straight As. Did it and have been doing well at academics ever since. 3.5 ungrad premed GPA, 3.71 graduate GPA

One of the key factors, upon reflection, is when I was on academic probation I signed up for a time management course that met twice a week and was like 1 credit or something. I think this is what made the difference is gaining knowledge about how time management works and the leverage inherent in it and the massive benefits that accrue from implementing said strategies.

My recommendation:

#1 sign up for a class on study skills/ time management.

-resolve to do make doing well as vital to survival as breathing.

-eat right

-go to sleep on time

-get up early

-be early by 5 minutes to everything

-turn assignments in a day early

-get started on assignments the moment they are assigned

-study time management

Wish you the best in your endeavors. Depression is awful. Hope you find your way around/ through it. :-)
 

Jennywocky

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So. Basically I'm a tiny bit close to being on acadmic probation for having a less than 2.0 GPA.

I can't explain why I'm doing so bad. School is tied up too much with my ego and identity, having grown up being one of the "smart kids" in very small private schools. Now I go to a college with 30,000+ people and you can never stand out here unless you're very proactive.

No motivation. No career path. I'm disillusioned with the school sytem. In high school, though I had procrastination and anxiety, I was able to get through, because I had a concrete goal: make it to graduation, go to college. I read a blog post somewhere that said INSTPs find college easier because there are more N types as professors and you get to pick your own courses or something. That's not the case for me.

I also have social anxiety with a side order of depression. I have a doctor and therapist, but even they measure my improvement in how "well" I'm doing in school.
I just wanted to say don't feel like this is something uniquely difficult for you. My INTP kid is 20. He was already a bit unmotivated coming out of high school, he's smart enough to have been in the top ten of his class easily but just didn't care / have any motivation to work towards anything. He ended up getting into and going to great liberal arts college but after three semesters he still was unmotivated, barely pulling a 2.0, and had no idea what he wanted to do as a career / what degree to get, despite there being some great profs there and having good advisors. He just isn't sure, and nothing has struck him yet.

So he took last semester off to get a job and is not enrolled for the fall semester. Basically, it wasn't worth the cost / future debt until he had a decent idea of a field he could enjoy studying and get a job in, since he would have that debt to pay off.

Honestly, I wish I had been less "follow the path" when I was in college. I started in a degree my parents told me, I switched to English halfway through college because I enjoyed writing, and I happened to be fortunate enough to have the background (including computer skills/programming) to have a well-paying career in analyst work. But over the years, I wish I had gone into forensics or taken a chance in a more artistic field (writing or music) even if I would have starved for some years, just to see what I would have been able to accomplish.

I think it's always going to be an issue, especially if we are searching for a "best" fit occupation because every occupation / field of study has things that are not aligned with interests or that isn't the greatest. To be honest, nowadays I think of it more like a LTR as well -- there's not one person out there, there are various people out there who might be a match, and you find one you like decently enough and the commitment/passion comes through the work and effort invested.

I think.

Anyway.... have to run.
 

Blarraun

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I dropped out during my major depression, I felt powerless back then and unsure if anything I did had any preferable direction. Then I had to get a job.

Now I'm working and part time studying, saving the money to return to full time academia for another degree and use this time to lay back and explore the world. It's a bit different where I live because there's no need to pay for full-time studying as long as one's application wins over others, so it's equal to a 4 year long vacation to find what life has to offer and have fun while getting a degree, the only cost is living expenses, they even offer very cheap dorms that cost much less than my current room.
 

ProxyAmenRa

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Take a break, doing something else for a while and then try again. You may fare better when you are more mature.

You can also study the subjects you are interested in for free on the internet.
 

computerhxr

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I'm a repeat drop-out (elementary, high-school, college). I had to figure out how to make money other ways. University was a great experience, but I gave up ~12 units short with a 3.8 GPA. Basically failed or aced the classes. I got lucky because I always spent time with my interests (computers/engineering), and it's in demand.

I want to go back, but I have other education goals that are more interesting. You have to follow what you love, and then everything else isn't so bad. Maybe you just need to find a job that you enjoy and take a little less of a load?
 

Minuend

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Beep boop

Anxiety and depression are things that can impair your concentration. How much left of college do you have? If you plan on studying after college, I'd suggest trying to solve some of the issues you have first, else you might keep failing and struggle. Is your therapist actually good? Or do you think you might benefit from trying another?

I used to be depressed and anxiety, later on it turned out I had autism so those things combined made me fail uni a few times (I think I managed college somewhat due to the low quality of that school). Every time I picked myself back up and convinced myself I just had to "work harder". And I was super motivated every time.

The last year I tried I even went to the study hall at 8 every day and attended lectures when so. I went home around 15.00-16.00. Five days a week. I still ended up failing. At that time I was also unknowingly developing hyperthyroidism, so it might have been partially responsible for a reduced ability to concentrate.

I was also very set on doing whatever I wanted to do a 100%. I never considered taking a part time job or studying part time when I had the time to commit full. This was probably a mistake, as I might have been able to handle a reduced workload, even with the problems I had.

I kind of want to go back to studying since I used to be a very curious and exploring person and want to use brain powerz. But I tend to get annoyed and frustrated every time I pick up a book and my working memory fails me or my attention span refuse to work with me. For a long time I didn't read anything at all that wasn't lightweight internet things. Now I'm kinda starting to pick up books again and I do notice that small spark of motivation and curiosity.

There was this one lady who mentioned it might be possible to have a person help me (because of autism) navigate around campus, remembering deadlines etc etc. If so, I might be able to get some form of degree. I think the structure we had at high school and college helped me pass. Though my grades were everything from A to E. I'm not good at acquiring knowledge through written information, I think. I also tend to forget a lot, fast. I do wonder if I'm average in that area or actually much worse.

At least I don't have depression or anxiety anymore (though I do experience a great deal of stress easily which is probably autism related and something I work with to deal with more easily).
 

JimJambones

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I was on probation for two semesters for having such a low GPA, due to having stopped attending classes and for not taking some of my finals. That was quite stupid. I rebounded and made sure I put the minimum amount of effort in to graduate, which also wasn't very bright and limited by post college options dramatically. I did do very well in classes I took for fun.
 

Tannhauser

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Failed half of my modules in the first semester of my graduate degree. That was the first time I even got anything below average. Looking back, probably the number 1 reason was hubris: because I did pretty well in my undergraduate degree without too much effort, I felt that this might work in general. One has to realise that as one is taking steps towards more difficult stuff, one necessarily must put in more work (and find ways to engage oneself in the process of studying the subjects).

I think it is easy in that kind of situation to start blaming external factors, like rejecting the whole educational system and becoming disdainful of institutions etc (I was definitely guilty of this, and I think INTPs are experts at this in general). These ideas might be well justified, but both holding these beliefs and at the same time making use of the institutions' services is a self-contradiction which must be resolved, one way or another.
 

TheAdditional1

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What's your major? Or are you happy with it? I started out with mechanical engineering and soon realized it was not for me. How? I kept failing calculus. Utterly, ridiculously failed them. If I had to put a visual to it it would be very much akin to Mufasa's fall to doom - and just as heartbreaking. Also did very poorly at other engineering classes - all learning, no/very little intuition. I don't know if that's the case for many INTP's because I hear a lot of us like programming - not my thing. But anyway me and math are oil and water. Yucky.

I dropped Mech Eng, spent about a year in General Electives and expanded my experience a little bit, then finally started my new major (and minor, which I've already admitted elsewhere was Architecture). Suddenly so much was actually relevant, so much was playing to my strengths, so much connected to so many other things and I could tie everything together. I was happy, and I was intrigued, and I was motivated - not motivated enough to ever actually finish a chapter or to ever be proactive in writing a paper - but I was finally and truly interested - fascinated by the possibilities my major gave me. That saved me...and I scraped by. C student who will hopefully have A students working for me (judging by the type of interns we have).

But what came out of my new major was a slight boost in work ethic but a HUGE boost in ideas, concepts, connections, projections, and incorporation of many factors from my pretty diverse life, so that although I'll have next to no memory of much technical stuff, I can pretty much converse with the best on concepts, ideologies and the leading edge of new developments in this field. Not even trying to stoke my own ego or whatever - it's literally how I got my job, and there must be a God because the company I work with has never asked for my GPA.

So unless you're in a STEM discipline with technical necessities, don't worry about your grades. Just learn as much as you possibly can, and just worry about passing well enough to graduate. Lowering your standards will sometimes let you do much better overall than you would if they were higher. Now if you ARE in a STEM discipline then you might want to watch out, yeah. But I might also consider whether you are really doing what you want.

Self-sustained/intrinsic motivation and being able to love what you're doing more than simply needing to do what you're doing is key. I believe that if you're the kind of person who is INTP or drawn to such a lifestyle, then you are probably smart enough to excel in anything you want to - as long as you're in it for the right reasons.

Best of luck man (or girl) - I'm pretty sure that most of us have been in your position in some form or another.

...Unless of course, there are aliens in our midst.


*puts on tinfoil hat, slinks back into the shadows of paranoia; curtain falls*
 

Yellow

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I had a few bumps in the road during my college years. I remember one term in which I was working two jobs and taking 24 credits (science major). I got about 2 hours if sleep each night, so I wasn't all there. There were two classes - a PM Geology course, and a History class - that I would regularly forget about. Like, entirely. I ended up with a C in one and D in the other (science courses are always easier because they rely more on knowledge than regurgitation).

I had a similar issues with a few part time jobs during that era. I still wake up in a panic sometimes, wondering what I forgot to do.

Either way, if you choose to tackle your academic obstacles or save yourself further debt, things will work out if you are clever and willing to work hard.
 

Glider

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I dropped out of university, fooled around for a while started a business with two friends, dropped out of engineering college, worked as an orthopedic assistant, dropped out of that and finally found what i was looking for at age 25. Completed a master degree worked in that profession for two years before I found it did not fit me, started a phd and ended up again in a university, this time as a professor. I still question what I do, but cant find anything better.

So, keep on exploring your possibilities!
 
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gilliatt

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Education's purpose is to teach you how to live your life-developing your mind to deal with reality. Its theoretical and conceptual. Its about teaching yourself to think and if the university/college is crippilng a persons mind, not improving cognition development, well not being there might not be a total lost.
 

WALKYRIA

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of course man, i believe that every normally constituted intp fails or struggles with formal college education... for instance, the smartest people( ex: Einstein would'nt be Einstein if he didn't have Marcel Grossman, a hardworking and dedicated friend who helped him with all the grunt work of college.) and the leaders in the world failed, struggled or dropped out of school. Its a well known fact that the most succesful people are the " c "students rather than the " straight a "students.
In med school, a lot of succesful doctors have disclosed that they most likely would fail with the current educational system.


As mentionned by others, college purpose is to fit into society's frame... TO FIT IN !!! So, donot expect anything else from college than to give you the skills to fit somewhere in the society. In other words, college is not there to give you passion or much knowledge about the world... high school, basically does that to a certain extent. The rest you do it by yourselve.

What i personnaly didn't love about school/college/workforce.... is the "one size fits all " aspect of it and the inability to meet people i could relate with on a deeper level(that is how i arrived on this forum) and plan to change the world together( intellectual but laid back and non competitive people à la existentialist philosopher ways, like sartre etc...). Young people need to feel a sense of heroism and passion for what they do, without that they get depressed and fail... it's very normal.
 

Brontosaurie

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Yes, I dropped out then taught myself skills to make money and self-educate on my own time.

College/university has essentially been mostly training centers since the early 1900's. It's only really important if you need it as a credential to practice a certain vocation(law,medicine), want some Je recognition, or if just you want to go for the "experience" .
You dealing stocks?
 

TheManBeyond

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with so many interesting tutorials on youtube and so many free versions of software to download for students you only require a more or less cool computer to get some skills. if you are passionate enough and stop being a lazy piece of cocksucker you'll be a pro in like 2 years or less.
for example in the whole graphic design scene, and that's a big pile of things to learn there yo. including architecture! lolz
i've seen people learning 4 programming languages and shit about databases :S
less appealing for me but it is great to have such power.
 

Architect

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I recommend you do get you act together, you do get the degree, and you not drop out to "try again later". Seriously folks, one of the problems with young INTP's is that they see small hills as huge mountains. It's only a fucking 4 years, anybody can tough it out for a measly four years.

Here's what happens if you don't. If you decide to get a professional job later (as you likely will due to the fantastic pay and benefits) you'll find it much harder without the degree. Why? Well we're hiring millennials right now like crazy, I can tell you that the resumes without degrees don't even make it to our team. Not even the first cut.

Think of it, we've got hundreds of people to sift through, few or none of which really have any useful skills. We'll pay them the first year to do nothing but learn how to actually work. Why even bother with the non degreed kids? If they can't even make it through a degree they'd never last here.

Anyhow, the problem with putting it off is that your early 20's is a critical time, its the 'lever' for the rest of your life. Do it right now and you'll be set up correctly, and getting the life you want is so much easier with the right leverage at this point. Do it wrong and you'll likely never pull it together. At least that's statistically what I've seen from many hundreds I've known on both sides.
 

A_Scanner_Darkly

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I managed to get through my BA program after 6 years and graduate this year, but I was in an "easy" major and my transcript is blemished with an array of Ws and a few Fs. Especially in my last two years, I was miserable nearly every day due to the compounded causes of seeing the ugly reality of "higher education" face to face, girl problems, drug addiction, depression, dealing with social anxiety in a campus overflowing with people, and random somatic issues that would crop up from my psychological state.

The jobs listed as a good fit for me on my school's job portal seem unappealing and generic. I come from a family of immigrants who started at the bottom rung, so to "climb the ranks" in society was expected of me. I never wanted to work the kinds of jobs my parents have had to, but when I look at yuppie types like my brother I find that life equally distasteful. He's totally Americanized and has the generic apartment (soon to be suburban house with white-picket fence) with wife, dog, car, organic food in the fridge...and so on.

I hate this petty, 21st century, conform-to-the-media, 1st world, top-of-the-food-chain, consumerist, self-satisfied, egocentric, capitalistic, vainglorious, bullshit rat race of a lifestyle...but I guess it's the best option for me there is, unless I want to be some kind of martyr. If I have a shot at a comfortable life, I might as well take it and help as many people along as possible. I just hate the hierarchies, the conformity, and the pressures.

Fuck it.
 

lightfire

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I started HS doing good, last 2 years of HS were bad. I still graduated. I failed out of college. Went back to college, tripping and falling, and earned an AA degree. Got accepted into various Bachelor's Degree programs, started a couple, changed majors, but didn't complete it. Throughout this time I was building a career for myself and could not find a reason to pay for college if I could make money instead. I will look into company sponsored tuition reimbursement but whatever man.
 

Judd_INTP

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My GPA was ok for my first degree, better with second, and best with my last one. I did struggle a LOT when I began feeling invisible. Noting mattered anymore. Joining jomor society helped. Joining biology club helped. Marrying someone that was also going to the same college helped a LOT, and making friends in my major classes helped a TON. All of these things help you get to know the professors, other people in your classes, and motivate you to get your ass to class. There was one girl that almost always made one to two points higher than me on tests, we always studied together and shared notes, split making the study guides, and quizzed each other. My best grades were in classes with her, and she was in almost all of my upper division classes. So get involved, take classes that actually interest and challenge you. The first two years are a lot of general classes that we're not interesting, but you find the smartest person in the class and make friends.
 

travelnjones

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I was terrible in high school. I totally didn't care, and had over 180 sick days (My kidneys were failing but also just pretended sick). I graduated because as INTP I scored well on tests and put in just enough work.

I fell into junior college with no idea and no plan. My grades were not great I screwed around still. Not taking things seriously but tried to do some work. Then I stopped and got married and started working in tech. I say that because I was making my own money and spending my own money. I worked putting my wife through school.

I started taking classes again at a junior college but with work and wife I just took one night course at a time. Work was sometimes crazy but I had just one class to worry about. Having messed around in college before my goal was repair my GPA so I could transfer to a university. That was key for me, I said ok ill do all the work they ask for and if they talk about reading I will do that. If I did the reading I found I nearly always got 100% on tests. Its seemed like a little more consistent effort in school made it completely easy to get good grades, rather than slacking and stressing.

Also I have to say there was another weird thing. There was this weird Jungian synchronicity about the school I graduated from. I remember a kid in high school saying he was going to go there and I remember going there for a book sale and liking it. It had a cool campus that I liked. But I started going to a Junior college in walking distance to my house. That was a mistake. I didn't like being at the college near my house, and it was totally easy to leave and go home. Being at the college I got my degree from I was isolated enough / drove enough that I didn't want to leave once I got there. Also I didn't have friends going there, so no distraction.
 

baccheion

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I did poorly in college even though I liked the major. It was mainly due to sabotage. I'd keep getting graded down or shafted. In addition, a lingering motivation problem got extreme and I was also unable to find time to myself. It was further amplified by poor eating (not eating enough).

Assuming you're not being shafted, in hindsight I would've started on a supplement routine (multivitamin, D + K, and chelated/TRAACS magnesium; iodine protocol) and set things up to eat 3 times per day. Calisthenics and HIIT (in the dorm if I didn't want to go to the gym). In addition, I'd have sat and decided what I was trying to do. That is, am I going to class or not? Am I more concerned about grades or working on a startup? Do I like the major? If not, which would be better? Why am I there, what's it about, and what's the most efficient way to move in that direction? Do I need anything to help me along? What? Where am I going to get it?

I would've also ensured I was never around certain people, as they are prone to envy and/or sabotage. Most exist just to get in the way and push down the path of brain dead, cookie-cutter, and compliant. And I would've tried harder to be invisible, so I wouldn't be targeted by students and professors.

You mentioned anxiety and depression. Do you have any nutrient deficiencies? Vitamin D and magnesium insufficiency, for example, are fairly common. Ever tried any natural supplements to treat the issues?

Once I started working after graduation, it started again. The job was pointless, agonizing, involved working many hours on nothing, and was started just before the recession. The manager was terrible and I realized I was again wasting my time watching life tick away.
 

Judd_INTP

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I wonder how successful INTPs figure out what lifelong goals to tackle. I think science is a good field because it is never done. But it can be agonizingly tedious. However, it has infinite huge projects that take several lifetimes to complete. I have found near constant sources of learning in tackling plant microbiomes as a method to mitigate the effects of global climate change on failing crops.
 

baccheion

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I wonder how successful INTPs figure out what lifelong goals to tackle. I think science is a good field because it is never done. But it can be agonizingly tedious. However, it has infinite huge projects that take several lifetimes to complete. I have found near constant sources of learning in tackling plant microbiomes as a method to mitigate the effects of global climate change on failing crops.
Do they? I pick general directions and try to create freedom to move around as desired/necessary. Software engineering entered my field of view in high school, however, and stuck. On the other hand, the actual jobs sucked while I was working (ie, need to work alone to truly enjoy it).
 

Judd_INTP

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I seem to remember a description of INTP that emphasized the search for purpose as their actual purpose....so maybe they never do find their purpose. Man that would be boring, knowing your purpose...seems so limiting. Ok yeah I get it, freedom to move around is definitely important. I grant jump. So strings of temporary grant positions (3 years or so) allow some flexibility to alter focus or location.
 

Lurker

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Yes, I dropped out of grad school because getting an advanced degree in education wasn't a good fit for me. At the time, my life was falling apart, too. Honestly, I thought it was a joke.

Hang in there. People will always judge you and criticize you, but they aren't in your shoes. hug
 

lightfire

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I wish education wasnt so expensive.
 
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