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Preaching to the Choir

Pizzabeak

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What's the point of life, in your opinion?

There's some indication that complaining and whining about stuff can get things done, aka "change". Thoughts?

If there's a girl you like, and she doesn't like you back, do you just have to talk as much as possible past a threshold point in order for you plan/goal to come to fruition? What's the science behind it?

Everything has already been known for at least 850,000 years of human society and civilization; there's nothing new under the sun. It's basically like writing computer programs then just constantly updating the code, fixing bugs.

Just because you say something, doesn't mean other people didn't think of it either. If you were the first to say something in a closed type event, it would appear as if you get some (social) "credit" for it, which may or may not even really be valid under the appropriate system.

From my observations people just try to "provoke" a response without having to directly do so, as an "indirect" technique of trying to gauge someone's I or EQ. That is synonymous with making real cold, hard cash, so it's like bitcoin mining, and performing subtle actions in surreptitious warfare to pool more resources for you and yours (probably didn't add enough content about bitcoin technology there; etc). Propaganda, Nazi era research developments is the current paradigm people operate under as far as I can tell.
 

Adaire

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If there's a girl you like, and she doesn't like you back, do you just have to talk as much as possible past a threshold point in order for you plan/goal to come to fruition? What's the science behind it?
Don't do this. It's obnoxious.
If you wanna hold out hope, fine, but do it quietly and let them come to you first.
 

Adaire

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Clarification: this is supposing a rejection since he said 'she doesn't like you back.'
 

QuickTwist

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I could have sworn I posted something here...

In any case, yes, nothing new under the sun. In fact, we don't even know if there have been more advanced civilizations than us or not... Ofc, probably in a different way, but take the pyramids for example (and those still exist, never mind stuff that has no trace for stuff to exist): no one knows exactly how they did it. To me, that is evidence that we probably shouldn't think of other civilizations as "less superior" than us.

We live in an era of arrogance.
 

Hadoblado

think again losers
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I don't understand how you think people aren't learning new things.

Building the pyramids so fast was crazy for their tech level, and we might not understand everything about it, but we could build them faster now, because we know more. We put people in space. We're changing the climate of the entire world. We have the internet and the nuclear bomb.

These are new things that weren't known by the Egyptians, or anyone else before them. I don't really understand what you're talking about. Are you two denying invention?

Also, how is this tacked onto a conversation about harassing girls?

:question:
 

QuickTwist

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I don't understand how you think people aren't learning new things.

Building the pyramids so fast was crazy for their tech level, and we might not understand everything about it, but we could build them faster now, because we know more. We put people in space. We're changing the climate of the entire world. We have the internet and the nuclear bomb.

These are new things that weren't known by the Egyptians, or anyone else before them. I don't really understand what you're talking about. Are you two denying invention?

Also, how is this tacked onto a conversation about harassing girls?

:question:
The point of my post was that we don't know if there have been civilizations that are more advanced than us... A lot gets erased with time. For all we know, the Babylonians were more advanced than we are.
 

Cognisant

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If there's a girl you like, and she doesn't like you back, do you just have to talk as much as possible past a threshold point in order for you plan/goal to come to fruition? What's the science behind it?
Flirting I think, but if she doesn't want to deal with you at all then you're not going to get anywhere, it's a two way thing, she needs to flirt with you too.

As I understand it flirting is conveying a willingness to mate without outright saying "hey Becky wanna fuck?", it's joking with someone but doing it in such a way that it heads towards increasingly dirty humour.

Like you start off with regular jokes, then test the waters with something a bit more dark or twisted, then maybe some bum stuff, then sex jokes, finally you're "jokingly" complimenting their body.

What's important is that you don't take it too fast or progress to the next level of rudeness until they seem comfortable with where you're at.

Even then no guarantees.
 

Pizzabeak

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If there's a girl you like, and she doesn't like you back, do you just have to talk as much as possible past a threshold point in order for your plan/goal to come to fruition? What's the science behind it?
Don't do this. It's obnoxious.
If you wanna hold out hope, fine, but do it quietly and let them come to you first.
Okay. So just "be yourself" and play "hard to get", while acting like you don't like the girl? Holding out hope is one thing, otherwise you have to "be confident" and get it yourself. It's a risk and payoff, not an entertaining gamble (unless you are that kind of guy and find it so, which some people might not find attractive, so you "can't please everyone").

Once you say something, it makes people think about it and they start to believe it. So as you get to know someone you figure out if you like them or not over time. Then someone else can come along during that, and attract your attention even more. I don't think "they" really come to you first. People believe what they'll believe if it works for them. The female of the species is designed to provoke extra testosterone out of the male to cause more aggressive behavior, irrespective of civilization's norms.
 

Pizzabeak

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I don't understand how you think people aren't learning new things.

Building the pyramids so fast was crazy for their tech level, and we might not understand everything about it, but we could build them faster now, because we know more. We put people in space. We're changing the climate of the entire world. We have the internet and the nuclear bomb.

These are new things that weren't known by the Egyptians, or anyone else before them. I don't really understand what you're talking about. Are you two denying invention?

Also, how is this tacked onto a conversation about harassing girls?

:question:
We've also lost a lot of knowledge since ancient times. I never said people aren't learning new things, but can see how you don't understand that.

Writing stuff down isn't the only mode of information transcription or storing data in byte format. Any new stuff we discover these days, are just additional factoids that don't change much since in science everything is predicted before actually discovered, as the math in hypotheses imply.

We're causing climate change but can't really change a thing for good or bad. What's all this "we" stuff? Why are you talking to me like I don't know this or wasn't a part of it? That's called progression. If you want a pizza, put it in the oven. Then, wait 30 minutes.

It doesn't mean you can get a pizza on demand just because you can see how to conceive of one. So now you're putting words in my mouth? I don't understand what you're trying to talk about. If you don't get something, that's your fault and I'm not here to hold your hand all day to help you learn.
 

Hadoblado

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You said
there's nothing new under the sun
This implies that, for example, putting people on the moon is not new.

Writing stuff down isn't the only mode of information transcription or storing date in byte format. Any new stuff we discover these days, are just additional factoids that don't change much since in science everything is predicted before actually discovered, as the math in hypotheses imply.
Also science doesn't always predict things before it finds them. That's not how it works. Sometimes it does, but many, many studies give results that aren't expected.
 

Pizzabeak

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You said
there's nothing new under the sun
This implies that, for example, putting people on the moon is not new.

Writing stuff down isn't the only mode of information transcription or storing date in byte format. Any new stuff we discover these days, are just additional factoids that don't change much since in science everything is predicted before actually discovered, as the math in hypotheses imply.
Also science doesn't always predict things before it finds them. That's not how it works. Sometimes it does, but many, many studies give results that aren't expected.
Things can be discovered on accident, like penicillin. It doesn't always have to be predicted, even so, most things aren't out of the ordinary at all, after the fact.

And there still isn't anything new under the sun. Putting people on the moon was only a matter of time, and that's if it even really happened when they said it did in 1969, you can't prove that conspiracy true or not based on the videos. So they still could have went.

Once people were put on the moon, it still didn't change the world that much. And yet, it isn't quite that most things are just "a given".

Most "new" things or events don't necessarily convey any new information about the universe.
 

Adaire

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Okay. So just "be yourself" and play "hard to get", while acting like you don't like the girl? Holding out hope is one thing, otherwise you have to "be confident" and get it yourself. It's a risk and payoff, not an entertaining gamble (unless you are that kind of guy and find it so, which some people might not find attractive, so you "can't please everyone").
No. It means leave them alone in that regard. Learn to respect other people's choices.

Once you say something, it makes people think about it and they start to believe it. So as you get to know someone you figure out if you like them or not over time. Then someone else can come along during that, and attract your attention even more. I don't think "they" really come to you first. People believe what they'll believe if it works for them. The female of the species is designed to provoke extra testosterone out of the male to cause more aggressive behavior, irrespective of civilization's norms.
This doesn't make any sense. Control your hormones.
 

redbaron

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there's two options:
1. she isn't interested - leave it alone. if she becomes interested and lets you know, great. if not, leave it.
2. she's playing hard to get. people that do this are annoying and you shouldn't enable them. the best thing to do is again, leave it alone
 

washti

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I understand that it feels bad to be unwanted but your posts sound like trying to figure out how to force her to like you.
Which is also sad. Someone doesn't prefer you. However hard and painful it's posible to respect it and move on.

Similarly, you certainly have such people - would you like them to force you to like them back by controlling and manipulative behavior or leave you alone and look for someone else?
 

Cognisant

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I think it’s worth having a discussion about what guys should do to be proactive about seeking a partner, there’s no shortage of scorn for men doing the wrong thing or having the wrong opinion but very little guidance to the contrary. Indeed such a topic is difficult to discuss as being proactive in seeking a partner can be easily misconstrued or misunderstood as objectifying women, to be seeing them as things to be gotten.

I think a good foundational concept is that people enter relationships by choice, that there’s no secret technique that’ll let you making someone else’s decisions for them, if a woman decides she wants to be with you that’s because she decided so and if not that is also her decision to make. Consequently if you want to be with someone and they don’t want to be with you that should be an impetus to examine yourself, just as there are reasons why you want to be with this person there are reasons why they may not want to be with you.

These reasons should not be cause for despair, if you’re unfit get fit, if you’re unkempt get kempt, if you’re boring learn to be entertaining, if you’re unkind be kinder (praise is cheap yet highly valued), if you’re ill-spoken practice being articulate. These are all ways a man can be proactive about seeking a partner, it may not get him the particular partner he wants (especially if she is already with someone else) but no effort made towards self-improvement is ever wasted.

After all if a man is fit, well dressed, entertaining, kind, well-spoken and there’s nothing else particularly wrong with him what woman (or man) wouldn’t adore him? That is how you “make” a woman love you, not by forcing her but by forcing yourself to change and to change so much so that there must be something wrong with her if she doesn’t fall for you, in which case you should stop wasting your time.
 

Pizzabeak

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That's not fair. It suggests there's someone out there for everyone, so you shouldn't be upset or angry if you haven't found your partner or your own soulmate yet.

Also, how did this thread turn into a discussion about a girl? It wasn't even really about that. Not everyone is into the same things. So if she's not into you, there could be reasons or she could be into someone else at that time. After all it was Pascal who said a man's unhappiness comes from his inability to stay alone in his own room.
 

redbaron

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After all if a man is fit, well dressed, entertaining, kind, well-spoken and there’s nothing else particularly wrong with him what woman (or man) wouldn’t adore him?
wow i love this forum sometimes
 

Adaire

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Nah. Keep trying to angle towards bum stuff (space yeti style) in conversation Cog. It's foolproof.
 

Cognisant

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Different timescale, over a long period of time self improvement is the best strategy but a women isn't going to just faun over an attractive guy unless he puts in some effort to flirt with her.

And yeah clearly I'm no expert on flirting.
 

Cognisant

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That's not fair. It suggests there's someone out there for everyone, so you shouldn't be upset or angry if you haven't found your partner or your own soulmate yet.
Fair is a coin toss, I never said there's a Jill for every Jack and if you have a problem with that take it up with God.
 

Pizzabeak

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That's not fair. It suggests there's someone out there for everyone, so you shouldn't be upset or angry if you haven't found your partner or your own soulmate yet.
Fair is a coin toss, I never said there's a Jill for every Jack and if you have a problem with that take it up with God.
But it isn't really just everyone's subjective gods. There should be one, objective God that everyone's life path is connected to, so if certain results or places you find yourself at in life don't please you or make you happy, then maybe religion isn't for you, and your answers to the ceasing of your suffering can be found elsewhere. In fact, looking at statistics and practicality there can't be girl for every boy out there, not in this lifetime at least. That alone is under the will of God along the lines of faith or His awesome glory. There isn't much else you can do if you study physics, which most people don't. People think ignoring that and going for computer science or IT networking means God doesn't or won't exist for them, but if a tree falls in a forest and no one was around to hear it does it still make a noise? So everyone is scrambling for their own right to experience, in this mad dash for existence and affirmation, little more than a rat race, ego could be important for an organism's survival.
 

Pizzabeak

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I understand that it feels bad to be unwanted but your posts sound like trying to figure out how to force her to like you.
Which is also sad. Someone doesn't prefer you. However hard and painful it's posible to respect it and move on.

Similarly, you certainly have such people - would you like them to force you to like them back by controlling and manipulative behavior or leave you alone and look for someone else?
It must be about being in the right place at the right time, or just plain time and chance. No one is an expert on any of these dating matters and trying to be doesn't work or get you anywhere. That certainly isn't novel information on anything since people just try and break the mold. It's all been said and done before already. Anyone can say anything, doesn't mean much as talk is cheap. Trying to have better dreams or any qualia doesn't mean you "deserve" anything because that doesn't mean you excel more at anything, or that your brain is just different so that could hopefully imply for you you're special or somehow smarter than anyone else.
 

Pizzabeak

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Okay. So just "be yourself" and play "hard to get", while acting like you don't like the girl? Holding out hope is one thing, otherwise you have to "be confident" and get it yourself. It's a risk and payoff, not an entertaining gamble (unless you are that kind of guy and find it so, which some people might not find attractive, so you "can't please everyone").
No. It means leave them alone in that regard. Learn to respect other people's choices.

Once you say something, it makes people think about it and they start to believe it. So as you get to know someone you figure out if you like them or not over time. Then someone else can come along during that, and attract your attention even more. I don't think "they" really come to you first. People believe what they'll believe if it works for them. The female of the species is designed to provoke extra testosterone out of the male to cause more aggressive behavior, irrespective of civilization's norms.
This doesn't make any sense. Control your hormones.
It makes as much sense as anything can. And yet it boils down to just that.
 

Cognisant

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I dare you to say that to a pregnant woman irl.
 

QuickTwist

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After all if a man is fit, well dressed, entertaining, kind, well-spoken and there’s nothing else particularly wrong with him what woman (or man) wouldn’t adore him?
wow i love this forum sometimes
Australia is weird af... I mean, it's kinda like California, except with alligators. OK, I got it, Australia is California and Florida's baby.
 

onesteptwostep

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I think the point of life is to redeem humanity. I mean that in sense of it as a collective whole. From? Well, I can't spell out everything but ultimately to redeem it to a point where humanity was created good, as in where people trust each other and love one another. So sort of like a perpetual Christmas, where the community lay down their metaphorical guns and sing carols together in the snow, like the Germans and the British did in WW2.
 

Pizzabeak

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It might just be that I need to change this thread's title to Beating a dead horse or something similar. It looks like the phrase “preaching to the choir” didn’t end up helping much in the end.
 

Pizzabeak

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Upon further review, I will not be requesting a name change for this thread, or throwing the idea out there more just to communicate a message, and show off how creative I am.

Anything from stating the obvious to something more metaphorical and creative sounding to pot calling the kettle black, or in an emergency, preaching to the choir will all work, and it's not just to give it a Church overtone.

I don't believe it's about provoking more Fe. In fact, the satirical content of this thread is why I gave it that title in the first place, and if you didn't get that, you don't deserve a response. If anyone here "deserves" to even half jokingly imply they're more socially conscious or "aware" than anyone else on purpose, it's me.

So that doesn't make sense. There is no monopoly on words in a language, let alone common sentences or phrases.
 
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