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What is the Nature of Consiousness?

Cognisant

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Is it a thing, a process, something else?

Remember this is the Philosophy section so you will be expected to share your reasoning and it will be examined for accuracy, if your beliefs are based on faith you're better off saying your piece in the Faith & Spirituality section.
 

Grayman

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Is it a thing, a process, something else?

Remember this is the Philosophy section so you will be expected to share your reasoning and it will be examined for accuracy, if your beliefs are based on faith you're better off saying your piece in the Faith & Spirituality section.

The only certainty is that I am an observer and therefore consciousness.

I suppose it is apparent in those who can go against thier biological nature. It is a force that is seperate from and works in opposition to physical reality.
 

Cognisant

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To experience.
You didn't read the OP.

I think it's a reasonable assumption that conscious is a process, not a thing.

Furthermore given the many ways consciousness can be affected by physically (being drugged, knocked unconscious, electrode stimulation) it seems highly probable that consciousness is at least in some way a physical process even if this physicality is merely the motion of electrons in the brain.
 

PhoenixRising

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Consciousness: The ability to take in and process information, and to make judgements.

I see the phenomenon of consciousness as a sliding scale more than something with absolute definition. Consciousness is really a dual component to awareness - awareness being the ability to take in information. What defines consciousness is the ability to make judgements, but it can not manifest without awareness being operational first. In my opinion, we are not conscious when we're born, we only take in information from our senses and react viscerally to it. There is no judgement happening because we have no information to draw associations from. Consciousness develops in an individual rapidly as the information taken in is stored and compared to new information. As a person matures, they become more and more conscious - they develop a worldview composed of their judgements about reality.
 

EyeSeeCold

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Motion detectors can sense environmental changes and then act according to protocol. Combined with robotic technology, motion detectors could create a very environmentally-aware and autonomous being.

But would that robot be self-aware? You could add some internal monitoring, such as temperature, geolocation, or chemical/physical analysis etc. It would be able to orient itself and gain data about itself to the extent that it would be reasonably self-aware.

Now with the above we have a mechanical process of being aware in-the-world. But is it conscious? Compared to humans, not that humans must be the standard of consciousness, I think the biggest difference would be that the robot would never act against its own programming unless it was programmed to. It would never act in a way that defies its design. On the contrary, humans are optimized for walking upright on two feet, but we can walk on all fours for fun if we wanted to, or we could skip around.

I don't know where consciousness comes from but it seems to at least involve deliberate intent whether in reasoning or action.
 

Void

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I'd say consciousness is the process of free will.
 

Auburn

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The nature of consciousness is not dependent on form.. as we will soon prove, by creating consciousness in non-biological form.

The nature of consciousness is conceptual. It is the concept of information assimilation and discrimination, as a feedback system. Wherever this concept can be mirrored, there is consciousness.

I agree with Phoenix that this comes in degrees. A CPU in a video game has these qualities but they are so basic that we typically don't call them conscious. For our purposes, then, I'd add another parameter and say that "consciousness" also requires a certain caliber of computation ability in this feedback system. Something roughly over 100 trillion computations per second.
 

Cognisant

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The classic test of self awareness is a response to a mirror image as the reflection is the closest manifestation to the concept of self.

I could program an FPS bot to learn and optimize its behavior in regard to a specific goal, if this bot then encountered a reflection of itself it could learn not to waste ammunition on it which would be a minor success, a major success would be if the bot could use the same reflection to solve a puzzle, for example navigating a maze by looking at its reflection on a ceiling raise above the maze.

An even better result would be if a bot navigated said maze while using what it could see to both avoid enemies and to anticipate them, for instance if it saw an enemy approaching it and took position to engage it before the enemy entered its direct line of sight then it would seem the bot was conceptually aware of the relationship between its situation and the reflection above it.

An astounding result would be if there was two teams of bots who are capable of healing their teammates in some way (which they're not outright programmed to do) and they decide to do so despite their goal simply being to kill the other team, this would demonstrate them projecting their self concept upon each other, a behavioral display of empathy.
 

Vrecknidj

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I've been thinking about this lately (in part because of some lectures I've been listening to). I think that it's useful to consider this from (at least these) two perspectives.

From Within (the introcosm)
This is the sort of phenomenological way of considering it. Pick a reasonably normal, reasonably linguistically capable individual, who happens to be self-conscious (i.e. awake, not brain damaged, etc.) and ask that person, "From within, what is it like to be conscious?" This will generate a variety of results, I suppose, from person to person, but, I think there will be wide swaths of similarities. In other words, from the first-person point of view, it definitely feels like, or is like, something to be conscious. There is some nebulous group of descriptions "I am aware that I am aware" and "I am aware of myself" and the like, that will probably all be things that such individuals could report or at least agree to.

From Without (the exocosm)
This might be what it's like, from an outsider's point of view, to consider what consciousness is like, in others, when those others are examined. My dogs, for instance, certainly seem (while awake, etc.) more like conscious things than, say, my laptop (or, my laptop running a chess simulator). And, some features of my laptop seem more conscious than, say, my thermostat, and my thermostat seems more conscious than, say, a rug on my floor. What I mean here is that we can say things like "The furnace sounds like it's trying to come on" when it's cold, and, though we can joke and laugh and say things like "Well, of course, the furnace doesn't really try to do anything." But, the rug on my floor, well, it doesn't really seem to do the sorts of things that we think of when we attribute consciousness to something. This, perhaps, slides eventually into stuff like Turing tests.

I think that the Rationalists (or Idealists, depending upon how one uses the term), in philosophy (in particular, the group through which a thread could be drawn, from, say, Plato, through Descartes, Spinoza, perhaps some of Kant, definitely Husserl), start from the introcosm and attempt to say something, eventually, in their metaphysics, about the exocosm. And, of course, they usually fail.

I think that the Empiricists (say, the group from Aristotle through Bacon, Locke, Berkeley, Hume, and later into Carnap and Russell), start from the exocosm and attempt to say something, eventually, in their metaphysics, about the introcosm. And, of course, they too usually fail.

Bridging the gap isn't easy. Maybe it's impossible.

I think that an introcosmic sense of consciousness is different from an exocosmic sense of consciousness. I think that they're both relevant and important. I'm not sure I'm ready to defend a position (and, so, perhaps I'm technically in violation of the rules -- sorry about that Cognisant).

However, I do think that this consideration is useful in informing how we move forward in our thinking about the problem suggested here.
 

Polaris

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Not sure if I'm stating the blatantly obvious here, but the nature of consciousness is entirely physiological. I think, similarly to Phoenix, that consciousness is process-based, and operating along a gradient. The issue is, however, you will need the bio-chemical component for consciousness (if consciousness is to be defined from an anthropocentric viewpoint) to emerge. A single process could not be said to be conscious as per this definition; we need a multiple of highly complex processes working together. Still, mere computation ability does not produce consciousness, if consciousness is to be defined as something having some kind of processing 'will', or meta-perception ability. You would have to add an emotional component. Consciousness is an illusion experienced by each individual, and strongly connected to feelings. Emotion emerges from highly complex mechanistic/biochemical processes. The human brain is bio-chemical in nature, and the bio-electric part relies on the bio-chemical.

Also, does consciousness necessarily require self-awareness? I agree with Phoenix that consciousness/self-awareness develops over time as we experience what we put into the external world somehow reflects back on us; we understand how to manipulate our surroundings by will and are thus aware as being the agents of these actions and reactions. By this definition, one could say animals also possess consciousness, although there are higher and lower orders. Hold a newborn human infant up in front of a mirror and there is pretty much no 'recognition' as such. But the infant is still thought to have a consciousness, because it is human. Consciousness is there; self-awareness develops over time.

So, how would we construct machines connected to an emotional circuit?

Edit: how many times did Polaris use the word 'consciousness'? :/
 

BigApplePi

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Haven't read this thread lately so only responding with some thoughts. Consciousness requires some definition and I'm sure there are tries in this thread. I would want to say consciousness is a special emergent awareness of the object which is deemed conscious and the object's environment. This awareness is a unified approach to the environment.

We could take a try at the eight cognitive functions. If a brick stands before me and I can take it in sensorily and have the potential to relate to it, that is Se consciousness. If I am internally motivated with a desire to talk to you, that is Fe consciousness. I don't have to be aware of internal emotions (Fi). If I look in the mirror and don't have awareness that is me, that part of me isn't functioning consciously. I may be aware (conscious) of a lot of other stuff.

Note that a bat has very strong awareness (Se) of its external environment possessing a consciousness we don't have. A shark is very conscious of other swimming creatures due to the electrical stimulation life gives off ... something humans don't have at all. This has been experimentally verified.

Can machines have emotions? Ordinarily one can pound on a machine and if hard enough, it collapses. No resistance. What about robots? Sure. They can be programmed to resist, avoid attack and even fight back. Sounds like primitive emotion to me (Fe).

Note that consciousness being an emergent viewpoint of a whole, it difficult to detect. Why? Because one can't have a viewpoint of a whole unless the parts are present. The shark may be conscious of living creatures but isn't sophisticated enough to tell food from a human from a surfboard. It's consciousness is limited just as ours is.
 

J-man

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I don't accept the notion that there is such a thing as consciousness.

Consider the fact that you're using the intellect, building models in your brain, to understand reality. But all you can do is build models; you can't go outside of the models with the intellect. You run into a wall. Perhaps from the point of view of the intellect, which I'll call part of the brain, one cannot see what is obvious to another part of the brain (and experienced).

A similar concept to what I'm talking about is when someone has had a corpus callosotomy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZMLzP1VCANo

Similar to how the language-processing part of the brain cannot access information from one eye, the intellect cannot connect with this thing we call consciousness. Perhaps.
 

Godofdogs

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consciousness itself is the nature. being conscious is the nature of consciousness.
 

ActiveMind

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You didn't read the OP.

I think it's a reasonable assumption that conscious is a process, not a thing.

Furthermore given the many ways consciousness can be affected by physically (being drugged, knocked unconscious, electrode stimulation) it seems highly probable that consciousness is at least in some way a physical process even if this physicality is merely the motion of electrons in the brain.


Sorry, the nature of consciousness is to experience, which is an evolutionary process, IMO. We are conscious at birth, though we do not remember it, yet as the years pass, we have unique experiences across an equally unique spectrum, our consciousness continually evolves. Therefore, it is to experience the full spectrum of life, IMO.
 

John_Mann

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I like the concept of panpsychism (a switch have a simple kind of awareness) and I think the human counsciousness is a high level language of pattern recognition. It's a set of bits of selfawareness. My question would be what is a bit?

All in all I'm a dualist materialist. The mind it's not a material thing and is more related to the fundamental forces. I don't know if the mind is dependant or not from matter. I tend to take the mind as independant from matter.
 

Variform

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Is it a thing, a process, something else?

Remember this is the Philosophy section so you will be expected to share your reasoning and it will be examined for accuracy, if your beliefs are based on faith you're better off saying your piece in the Faith & Spirituality section.

It is an energy. When people die we lose their consciousness. When you die, the world stops to exist. Not you, yourself.

Energy is the basis of everything. Stop eating and you die. What is it that you miss? Energy in food. So consciousness is energy.
 

EyeSeeCold

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The mechanistic view
YcTLlMd.png


Our sense organs receive data, and the nervous system translates it to information, which the gestalt body then uses as basis for action. Humans have a natural drive for responsive action through instincts, emotions and other factors. Without a system of feedback, it would likely be impossible to test for consciousness.

So what is the nature of consciousness?

If one lost the ability to respond, have they suddenly lost consciousness? What if one cannot perceive the external reality?

Consciousness must be both consensual and solipsistic.
 

Variform

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Such gfx are very meaningless. Maybe it is me. I don't get it. What do the arrows means? Why are tyhey in-between these two circles? How does that explain anything? Affirmation of self, what does that even mean. How does it feel? Where can I locate it.

Stupid pictures.

You don't need them to state exactly what you understand. "Consciousness must be both consensual and solipsistic."
 

EyeSeeCold

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The visual adds another dimension to the concept other than the textual one.

Everything is contained within the bubble of Consciousness, signifying that Consciousness is composed of those things and possibly more. It also is a visual representation of the idea that "reality" is only a subset of one's consciousness(solipsism), because without consciousness, one cannot be conscious of reality.

The two smaller bubbles represent the outer world as experienced, and the inner world of your own thoughts, feelings, and other deep rooted traits of humanity.

Affirmation of Self is the involvement of oneself in the outer world, which is virtually anything, but more emphatically the activities one does that highlight oneself as an unique individual. Internalization is plainly the experiences you take in. The arrows represent the ongoing process of being-in-the-world(affirmation of self) and experiencing-the-world(internalization).
 

TimeAsylums

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Formal Definition of Consciousness and What Is Consciousness?

The Origin of Consciousness - Julian Jaynes

I'm with Jaynes' view[Third Link] (whether you argue if it was the common cold, or psychotropics, or any mechanism of evolution is trivial)

As far as the 'nature' of consciousness,

@Absurdity shared a link not too long ago by Nick Land on cybernetics,

simply, a meta-circular loop or strange loop. S-R feedback / whatever

what most people usually mean today by 'consciousness' they mean 'awareness of consciousness' (see Jaynes)


@Polaris, based on the above, I would say that an infant is not 'yet' conscious.


@BAP even though you're not here. I feel like your attempts at 'consciousness' are an obfuscation.
Taken from the links above:


aspects of consciousness:

1. spatialization - having an internal mental 'space' in which hypothetical events can 'happen'. It is impossible to think of any events occurring in time without spatializing them, usually on a timeline running from left to right. People who are not conscious are incapable of thinking about time or putting things in a time-ordered sequence.

2. analog I - being able to see 'in' one's spatialized mind what one would 'see' if one were in a certain situation. For example, if a person comes to a fork while walking through a forest, they can 'see' 'in' their mind what they would through their eyes if they took either of the paths. It's based on this information that they can decide to take one path (perhaps more scenic) over the other.

3. analog Me - the 'I' is the subject performing actions, through whose eyes we 'see'. The 'Me' is an object 'seen' in its entirety. Contrast the first-person view in computer games with a third-person view behind the main character. One can often 'see' oneself performing actions 'in one's mind' as if one were 'outside' of one's own body.

4. excerption - the taking of a small aspect of something to stand for that whole thing. No one who thinks of their city, imagines every house, every streetcorner and every sewer. One takes something, perhaps the skyline or city hall, and let it stand for the whole thing. The same occurs for everything. Recalling one excerption after another by a chain of associations is what constitutes 'reminiscence'. For example, if one thinks of a summer trip to BritishColumbia?, the starting excerption might be a mountain lake, then the climb up to that lake, then the horse dung on the trail and the horse riding group going downwards, then the inn next to the lake, et cetera. Unconscious beings are incapable of this.

5. conciliation - something similar to assimilation of knowledge to fit a schema but done 'in' a conscious mind.

6. narratization - the constant unnoticed activity of thinking of one's life in terms of little stories, in which one is the star character.

the 'thing' that is consciousness is the collection of the 'processes'


For those that would like to step in with 'panpsychism' see second link (what is consciousness), and we are differentiating between 'phenomenal consciousness' and 'psychological consciousness.'
 

BigApplePi

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Is it a thing, a process, something else?
Consciousness is an intuition made possible by enough experience of sensations.

Think: S + S + S + ... --> N
 
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