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Unpredictable stories

Cognisant

cackling in the trenches
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Our stories reflect our philosophy and if I didn't already have a long list of other projects to attend to I'd spend the rest of this evening devising a multiple choice philosophy test based upon how people expect a given scene to play out.

For example a superhero interrupts a mugging and the mugger takes the intended victim hostage, putting a gun to their head and declaring intent to fire if the superhero comes any closer.

Option 1.
The superhero disarms the mugger without much difficulty.

Option 2.
The superhero is smart enough to understand the dynamics of the situation and backs off, knowing that doing anything otherwise would only endanger the hostage and that it's quite likely that they'll meet the mugger again under more favourable circumstances.

Option 3.
The superhero understands situational dynamics and takes it a step further, rather than creating the precedent that taking hostages is a valid tactic the superhero accepts that the hostage's safety is ultimately a factor beyond control and chooses to act upon factors that can be controlled, either "shooting the hostage" (ideally non-lethally but one can never be 100% sure of such things) to create an opening, or "calls the bluff" by advancing on the mugger, disregarding the safety of the hostage.

Option 4.
The superhero attempts to disarm the mugger but either startles the mugger into firing or accidentally sets the gun off by trying to melt it with heat vision, or something like that, in any case the hostage is killed.

Option 5.
The superhero manages to talk down the mugger and peacefully resolve the situation.

I'm not asking what you would do if you were the superhero, I'm asking you which outcome is more likely to occur, which one feels right to you?

I find it interesting that (at least in my experience) scenarios 2, 3 and 5 rarely occur in modern fiction (again, maybe that's just the genres I read) although if I were the writer I would almost always choose option 3 or 4 depending upon the intelligence of the protagonist. Anyway the apparent underrepresentation of 2 and 5 is an interesting insight into the way society thinks, we seem to be by large too cynical to accept that conflict can be resolved peacefully or that the mugger wouldn't harm the hostage if given the chance to get away. Also interesting is what I suspect is an overrepresentation of scenario 1 which I find to be completely incongruent with reality, granted that is my highly subjective point of view.

Please discuss the above and any other fictional scenarios you can think of, particularly ones that would come as a surprise to the audience, why are they surprising?

E.g. Could you imagine the powerful and stoic Superman/Batman pathetically begging a mere street thug to let a hostage go? It seems unrealistic at first glance, but think about it for a moment, they both have severe hero complexes (less so with Batman, depending upon the writer) that is to say the suffering/incurred-harm of others clearly bothers them far more than their own, which profiles them as exactly the sort of people who would go to pieces in a situation where the hostage's safety is beyond their control.

Indeed in popular culture the word "hero" is practically defined as self sacrifice for the sake of others, so much so that you might think it's the only definition, in actual fact that's far from true, classically the Byronic hero overcomes adversity mainly as a matter of self interest.
 
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I agree with your points regarding the stated options.

My style is different. All of this assumes the mugger knows the superhero is indeed a superhero. Option 6. The superhero baits the mugger by overtly not giving a damn and nonchalantly offering up 3 additional victims, who they both subsequently rob. The superhero then procedes to blow the mugger's brains out the moment he turns his back and return the stolen goods to the victims, exposing his covert motive.

What can I pull out of that philosophically? The hero in 6 essentially forces deferred gratification on the victims if he decides to return the loot, yet leaves his options open to take the entire booty for himself. It's a grand display of power which always results in a positive gain for the hero, whether that gain be loot or followers.
 

Cognisant

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But that's shit storytelling, I mean it all hinges on the mugger accepting help and the "hero's" ability to find those victims again after they've been robbed, it's about as compelling a narrative experience as playing a video game, saving before every decision, trying out all the options, then going with the one that gives you the most/best loot, which obviously is entirely missing the point of a narrative experience.

Granted forcibly deferred gratification is an interesting theme, I just think it would have to be done differently, maybe a Dexter like serial killer who goes around helping rape victims find closure by killing the rapists in ironic ways, so the detective who has to stop him/her has to enlist the help of one such victim, who all the while is unsure whose side she's on.
 
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it's about as compelling a narrative experience as playing a video game, saving before every decision, trying out all the options, then going with the one that gives you the most/best loot, which obviously is entirely missing the point of a narrative experience.

Granted forcibly deferred gratification is an interesting theme, I just think it would have to be done differently, maybe a Dexter like serial killer who goes around helping rape victims find closure by killing the rapists in ironic ways, so the detective who has to stop him/her has to enlist the help of one such victim, who all the while is unsure whose side she's on.

It's much more spur of the moment than that. More like envisioning the most desirable cluster of outcomes of a situation and picking the markov chain most likely to lead to that cluster. Nothing is sacred between points A and B, as evidenced by the 3 additional hypothetical victims. I would actually argue that it's difficult to narrate and more suitable to film.

As for the narrative aspect, what mugger expects someone to say "Then shoot them. IDGAF"? It puts the motives of the hero in a black box and projects power to the mugger himself. I find that getting anyone to ask "why?" is a demonstration of power, whether that power be real or perceived. Otherwise I've never watched Dexter. I actually don't even own a television...
 

Jennywocky

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Actually, I've seen #3 used more than once nowadays; the world seems more cynical nowadays so it's more likely, and basically to avoid expectation the writer is trying to add some tension to the scene. It's pretty badass, although it says something about the hero and I would hate to see it become a cliche.
 

Etheri

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Watching series as criminal minds, which clearly isn't fiction and superheroes, but I wouldn't call it straight reality either, option 3 and 4 have both been scened more than once. I find option 2 to almost never happen in series, yet it does happen in movies. Perhaps because in series, it would have to go over serveral episodes?
 

Jennywocky

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I think 1, 2, and 5 were dominant in a much more simplistic, happier time period in USA culture. But we generally acknowledge that this is no longer how it works. Criminals don't really respect the law enough for that approach to work, nor is the law as respectable as it would need to be to be given credibility.

(It's one reason why I find the conflict between 40's idealism as expressed by Captain America and the 2000's sense of pragmatism and maverick hero as expressed by Iron Man rather interesting under the Avengers concept.)
 

Cognisant

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I can relate to that in terms of technological determinism and the impracticality of only advancing science in harmless directions, for example I'm looking into using stick-on electrodes in something similar to an ECG setup so that of I tense my bicep and tricep simultaneously for three seconds I could silently activate some manner device without visibly moving any part of my body.

If I make and manufacture this as a ready to use kit what's the chances someone's going to use it for concealed weaponry? Indeed that's where the money is, if you want resources (and technology is all about having resources) the fastest/easiest ways to make money are either inventing new must-have gadgets for military use or some fancy new toy for fat white upper middle class young adults to play with, bonus points is you can achieve both with the one invention.

When it comes right down to it making the world a better place in a meaningful sense is hard.
 
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