Convince me to migrate: The Game

[Pyropyro]

Our family discussed immigration during our New Year's Eve celebration. They said that it might be best that I migrate somewhere since I don't have a girlfriend yet (also having a member of the family migrate improves that family's prestige). So far the choices provided were Australia (because my mom's self-appointed mom lives there) and South Korea (because my brother-in-law thinks I can practice there).

So INTPf, explain why your country (or country's province/state) is the best part of the world and why should I migrate to it.

You can use any criteria but the following are crucial factors:
Corruption: will I find myself dead if I pissed off someone powerful. I prefer to be jailed rather than buried alive.
INTP-friendliness: I prefer cold and objective to warm and touchy-feely places. Besides, I'm pretty sure I can find a Pinoy community there to recharge if I do miss my family and friends.
Girls: self-explanatory
Tech: Although I can probably enter a country as a blue-collar worker, I prefer to work in my field of expertise (Intellectual Property). Is your country a hub of inventors and techies?
Main Language: English is of course preferred but I can adapt quickly. I also have some rudimentary understanding of the Japanese and German languages.

To mods:

Spoiler

I don't know whether to place the thread in "Regional" or "Fun" so I put it in "the Lounge" to be safe. Please move as you see fit.

 

[TheManBeyond]

meet me in istanbul by fall. if not, japan would be in my opinion awesome.
wait edit. estonia is the place you are looking for.

 

[OrLevitate]

If moving somewhere else due to not having a girlfriend then it doesn't matter where you move so much so long as it's not a hugely dissonant culture to your own. The way that moving to another area would help is it cuts off your complacency due to the bonds you no longer have to fulfill your social needs. You're forced to either go interact with a bunch of new people and try to befriend them, and get used to putting yourself in uncomfortable situations, or become ultra hermit. You also get a boost to the "This is my life, I can do whatever I want" feeling, being out on your own, and more independent.

It's hit or miss though, and you could more easily stay where you are and put yourself in uncomfortable situations more often to get you out of having become complacent. If you feel constricted in your self growth by your family or other bonds there though you could also just cut them off from your life, although moving somewhere else would be a good excuse to protect their feelings if you're worried about that.

So, go wherever your family thinks is most prestigious without too much cultural dissonance from yours, if the family-prestige is a variable you're looking to affect.

I think your job has a bigger influence on your psychological equilibrium than you may perhaps maybe possibly think. Working a more degrading job like blue collar will probably just create more of a problem for you to overcome internally and you won't be concerned with finding a girlfriend. You'll just want a better place to spend most of your day and week. You'll also be working with less intelligent people, that you may despise but especially if you're an introvert, then they'll almost definitely take your silence as you thinking you're better than them and hate you before you even say anything. Totally depends on the specific group of people though! Definitely try and have a job lined up before you get there too. Like a relationship, but with a new land, you want to have the first few days/ weeks be a good, exciting, happy time as a base.

 

[Pyropyro]

meet me in istanbul by fall. if not, japan would be in my opinion awesome.
wait edit. estonia is the place you are looking for.

Japan is actually part of my list. Estonia and Turkey looks interesting.

 

[The Grey Man]

The United States are the greatest country on Earth. Canada's probably the best place to live.

If you're looking for somewhere INTP friendly, I don't know what to tell you, but there's variety everywhere...

 

[Pyropyro]

If moving somewhere else due to not having a girlfriend then it doesn't matter where you move so much so long as it's not a hugely dissonant culture to your own. The way that moving to another area would help is it cuts off your complacency due to the bonds you no longer have to fulfill your social needs. You're forced to either go interact with a bunch of new people and try to befriend them, and get used to putting yourself in uncomfortable situations, or become ultra hermit. You also get a boost to the "This is my life, I can do whatever I want" feeling, being out on your own, and more independent.

It's hit or miss though, and you could more easily stay where you are and put yourself in uncomfortable situations more often to get you out of having become complacent. If you feel constricted in your self growth by your family or other bonds there though you could also just cut them off from your life, although moving somewhere else would be a good excuse to protect their feelings if you're worried about that.

So, go wherever your family thinks is most prestigious without too much cultural dissonance from yours, if the family-prestige is a variable you're looking to affect.

Migration for me is more of a self-growth issue rather than a social duty. I find my job satisfactory but unless people above me die then I'll never get a promotion/tenure. I also want to have a fair working environment where you can at least be promoted because you're a hardworker rather than because you're a relative of one of the higher ups.

Social bonding might also be an issue. I might need to get into an international club to ease the transition. My friend, who will be moving to Canada soon, suggested that I join Toastmasters.

Prestige for my family is at the bottom of the criteria since I've already earned them a lot of cred anyways during my childhood. Anyways, if I did follow prestige then Canada and USA would be the best.

I think your job has a bigger influence on your psychological equilibrium than you may perhaps maybe possibly think. Working a more degrading job like blue collar will probably just create more of a problem for you to overcome internally and you won't be concerned with finding a girlfriend. You'll just want a better place to spend most of your day and week. You'll also be working with less intelligent people, that you may despise but especially if you're an introvert, then they'll almost definitely take your silence as you thinking you're better than them and hate you before you even say anything. Totally depends on the specific group of people though! Definitely try and have a job lined up before you get there too. Like a relationship, but with a new land, you want to have the first few days/ weeks be a good, exciting, happy time as a base.

Work is a big concern and this is why Australia is an attractive destination. I already have (sort of) family there and my former teacher is also working in one of their Universities. They might help me land a job at the academe.

Of course, a blue collar job isn't the best case scenario but we have to be realistic. Sometimes, it's the only job available and I have to get whatever I can. My dad had to do menial labor for a year in Canada to help improve our finances even if he's quite respected in his field in our country. As such, I'll probably wear that job as a badge of honor.

I'm quite talkative if I like you and can be communicative when I need to work with the client so being an introvert wouldn't be a problem.

 

[Pyropyro]

The United States are the greatest country on Earth. Canada's probably the best place to live.

If you're looking for somewhere INTP friendly, I don't know what to tell you, but there's variety everywhere...

Uncle Sam is touched by your patriotic duty. Canada is a good destination though although my friends there aren't that established yet.

 

[Cognisant]

Australia is a safe and prosperous country but stick to the cities, particularly those on the Eastern coast, we have our own breed of rednecks called bogans which ruin an otherwise perfect place to live.

This is a great place to immigrate to because we already have a lot of immigrants so as long as you speak English most people won't give a damn about where you're from, unless they're bogans but they're just scum so don't mind them.

 

[Pyropyro]

Australia is a safe and prosperous country but stick to the cities, particularly those on the Eastern coast, we have our own breed of rednecks called bogans which ruin an otherwise perfect place to live.

This is a great place to immigrate to because we already have a lot of immigrants so as long as you speak English most people won't give a damn about where you're from, unless they're bogans but they're just scum so don't mind them.

Thanks for the tips about the bogans. I'll steer away from them if I do get there.

Wait, you got Proxy and the Gopher there too right?

 

[Direwolf]

Yeah come to aus pyro. unless your moving to someone with experience, i would advise not moving to the bush. Stay in the east coast citu ateas they are better and less stuff their can kill you. Only problem would be bogans but their idiots, just ignore them.

 

[The Gopher]

Yeah heaps of forum people are in Australia. I won't say who specifically in case it's private but there are quite a few. I'm here so it's the obvious choice. Only thing I would say is try and get work locked down before you move. (applies to any place)

 

[Cherry Cola]

Consider Scandinavia too imo, along with Canada very good places to live.

In Japan you'll always remain an alien to some degree. Though I can see their formal and introverted culture working for an INTP.

 

[redbaron]

Come to Melbourne, Australia. There's a huge Asian community here and also me. Don't go anywhere further north than Sydney and don't go further west than Port Fairy - scum everywhere.

 

[Reluctantly]

I vote the Netherlands. Everyone I've met that has either lived there or lives there now seems to like it.

 

[Pyropyro]

I just contacted my mom's friend in Australia (my self appointed grandma). She's kind of thrilled about the idea and suggest that I migrate while I'm single. She's based in Sydney but she said I can go to my "uncle" at Melbourne as well.

She said that I should check the Australian Immigration office and check the jobs that is currently needed there and the point system needed as well.

 

[Absurdity]

Doesn't seem like you're considering it but I would urge you to stay away from the US. Granted, Silicon Valley is the place to be for IP, but everything here is outrageously overpriced and you'd probably have to live in a bad neighborhood for a while until you got established and built up your income. Also might not even be able to get a job in IP due to professional licensing requirements -- and don't even think about trying to go to law school here unless you're eager to amass six-figure student loan debt.

Our immigration process is also absolutely byzantine. About 5 years ago my dad got remarried to a non-citizen and then (obviously) filed the paperwork to get her residency. A pretty routine process that should have only taken a few months ended up being dragged out for almost two years. Had to hire a very expensive lawyer and get dragged through all sorts of shit.

I work with people from Australia, Canada, and Taiwan, but all of them either earned an advance degree here at a top school for $$$ or worked in finance were able to pay their way in.

If you were to try and come here, I would suggest staying away from expensive cities like New York, San Francisco, Los Angeles, and Seattle. There are a lot of opportunities in the Raleigh-Durham area in North Carolina. Even though it's in a "Southern" state, this particular area is extremely cosmopolitan, has three world-class universities (UNC, Duke, NCSU), strong tech sector, etc.

I honestly don't know anything about what countries are the best option to emigrate to, but I think I'll just list a bunch of places I'd consider if I was in your shoes: Switzerland, Malaysia, Singapore, Canada, Australia, Ireland, Hong Kong, Sweden, Germany, Denmark, Estonia.

 

[Cavallier]

Not sure if the following is helpful but...

I've got a friend that did alright in Japan for a few years and then was finally driven away by staunch xenophobia. The younger people are not so bad but the older generation suffers from rampant racism and generalized distaste or anything not Japanese. And, for better or worse, the older generation still runs Japan. Other than a few friends she never really felt fully accepted despite living there for 5 years.

She spent two years in Istanbul after that and really enjoyed it. She made deeper and longer lasting ties with people there as well as was allowed to progress her career further than when she was in Japan. She followed that up with a current stint in Dubai. Very very very expensive but she gets paid well so she's alright.

Oh, she was licensed to teach English everywhere she went so she seemed to manage to make enough money to survive wherever she washed up. I'm not sure if it helps you much but she spoke fluent German and because of that discovered that wherever she went she inexplicably found Germans who generally turned out to be helpful.

 

[Pyropyro]

Doesn't seem like you're considering it but I would urge you to stay away from the US. Granted, Silicon Valley is the place to be for IP, but everything here is outrageously overpriced and you'd probably have to live in a bad neighborhood for a while until you got established and built up your income. Also might not even be able to get a job in IP due to professional licensing requirements -- and don't even think about trying to go to law school here unless you're eager to amass six-figure student loan debt.

Our immigration process is also absolutely byzantine. About 5 years ago my dad got remarried to a non-citizen and then (obviously) filed the paperwork to get her residency. A pretty routine process that should have only taken a few months ended up being dragged out for almost two years. Had to hire a very expensive lawyer and get dragged through all sorts of shit.

I work with people from Australia, Canada, and Taiwan, but all of them either earned an advance degree here at a top school for $$$ or worked in finance were able to pay their way in.

If you were to try and come here, I would suggest staying away from expensive cities like New York, San Francisco, Los Angeles, and Seattle. There are a lot of opportunities in the Raleigh-Durham area in North Carolina. Even though it's in a "Southern" state, this particular area is extremely cosmopolitan, has three world-class universities (UNC, Duke, NCSU), strong tech sector, etc.

I honestly don't know anything about what countries are the best option to emigrate to, but I think I'll just list a bunch of places I'd consider if I was in your shoes: Switzerland, Malaysia, Singapore, Canada, Australia, Ireland, Hong Kong, Sweden, Germany, Denmark, Estonia.

I'm not planning to go to the US since I've already heard a lot of stories about the difficulty to immigrate there. I'm also considering Canada though so it is possible that I can live there and also work in the US.

We do have a lot of presence in the States especially in Hawaii where there was a great migration of Pinoy farmers during the early 1900s.

 

[Pyropyro]

Not sure if the following is helpful but...

I've got a friend that did alright in Japan for a few years and then was finally driven away by staunch xenophobia. The younger people are not so bad but the older generation suffers from rampant racism and generalized distaste or anything not Japanese. And, for better or worse, the older generation still runs Japan. Other than a few friends she never really felt fully accepted despite living there for 5 years.

WWII sentiments is still active between the two countries. We did something similar to what Poland did to Germany on their war machine. It'll probably ease up when the old generation dies but I can't wait that long :P.

However, we do have an "Enemy of my enemy is my friend" going on against China lately so the relationship might improve soon enough.

She spent two years in Istanbul after that and really enjoyed it. She made deeper and longer lasting ties with people there as well as was allowed to progress her career further than when she was in Japan. She followed that up with a current stint in Dubai. Very very very expensive but she gets paid well so she's alright.

Oh, she was licensed to teach English everywhere she went so she seemed to manage to make enough money to survive wherever she washed up. I'm not sure if it helps you much but she spoke fluent German and because of that discovered that wherever she went she inexplicably found Germans who generally turned out to be helpful.

Interesting. Can you ask your friend what type of license she used to teach English? That would be a very handy fallback profession.

 

[Meer]

Come to Canada, work in a hotel, say "ayos" lots.

Canada is nice, although cold in some places sometimes.

 

[TheManBeyond]

I've been in Montreal, it was beautiful. Look at me i'm so intuitive that the police held me for a while because i had lost a paper they give you in the plane (i think they asked stupid protocol questions and i thought it was stupid and didn't answered it -.- i thought it was something not necesary to answer or something like that) and when i finally found it was in my bag all the fucking time they of course were looking at me in that "you are such a weirdo, this guy is obviously a terrorist, let all passengers evacuate the plane before letting go this dangerous southamerican guy or even letting him explain himself and tell us he found his paper way" And i was just landing.

If police knew about mbti they would had come to the conclusion that they had a INFP in da plane not an INFJ aka mohamed atta.