• OK, it's on.
  • Please note that many, many Email Addresses used for spam, are not accepted at registration. Select a respectable Free email.

Joe Rogan

redbaron

consummate salt-extraction specialist
Local time
Tomorrow, 05:13
Joined
Jun 10, 2012
Messages
6,675
Location
38S 145E
#51
if you wanna discuss the validity of different typing methodologies that's fine. but do it without the personal insults

pmj you're appealing to an external system of typing that you've interpreted as having a measure of objectivity and reliability. pmj feels certainty because you have the support of an external 'authority' on typing

pizzabeak you're appealing to the superiority of an individual internalised interpretation of typology, which has an aspect of nuance and discernment of context (such as inter-type dynamics) that an external system can't control for. you feel certainty because your typing is consistent with your internal experiences.

~

if you want to debate the validity of your typing based on this conflict in approach to typology, or debate people's type based on why you think your approach is superior, then go ahead. cut out the insults though
 

Hadoblado

I em Hedo I like smell of grass
Local time
Tomorrow, 04:43
Joined
Mar 17, 2011
Messages
5,117
#53
I didn't know, I really only insult if someone starts it first.
You may have done "hallucinogens" (correct term is actually Psychedelic or Entheogen, thank you very much) but you clearly don't know shit. You didn't even read the link. You've no idea the history or potential of them. You're too scared, reasonably enough, to do the work. So just stay where you are boy and don't mess around with things you don't know about.

Reality could be a simulation. LSD causes hysteria in those who haven't tried it. What, so you tried low doses once or twice? Doesn't seem like much in a lifetime of worshipping it.
I'm just gonna go ahead and not believe you on that one. You've been acting out lately. Pmj was baiting you so that's somewhat mitigating, but you're not usually this reactive.

We're gonna need you to settle down.
 

PmjPmj

Full of stars.
Local time
Today, 20:13
Joined
Sep 18, 2012
Messages
1,394
Location
UK
#54
if you wanna discuss the validity of different typing methodologies that's fine. but do it without the personal insults
...

if you want to debate the validity of your typing based on this conflict in approach to typology, or debate people's type based on why you think your approach is superior, then go ahead. cut out the insults though
Cute.
 

travelnjones

Active Member
Local time
Today, 12:13
Joined
Feb 24, 2009
Messages
221
#55
Some stories about Elon seem to indicate he is an introvert at least anecdotally. He lives with some musician and he hid out when her friend was visiting. Sound like me when in laws are around.
 

Pizzabeak

Prolific Member
Local time
Today, 12:13
Joined
Jan 24, 2012
Messages
1,859
#56
He will be on Joe Rogan soon so we'll see. From what I've seen so far he seemed T, and E. ENXP are considered the most introverted extraverts. ENTJ seem like extroverts, they rarely come off as introverts.
 

Pizzabeak

Prolific Member
Local time
Today, 12:13
Joined
Jan 24, 2012
Messages
1,859
#57
He seems really weird or "autistic", might be an introvert because he's quiet. Seems awkward just now realizing that and to be honest, I only ever watched 1 short interview with him before. English is his second language based off his accent and I usually just see pictures of him or read his quotes. He might be an introvert. Maybe not INTJ. Could still be ENTJ. Or ENTP? He seems kind of like Mark Zuckerberg so maybe even like ISFP.
 

Pizzabeak

Prolific Member
Local time
Today, 12:13
Joined
Jan 24, 2012
Messages
1,859
#58
DP could actually be INFP, I only said ENTJ because there seemed to be Fi but something seemed off like it wasn't dominant so I said ENTJ. He could still be ISFP or INFP, but might be EXTJ.
 

Artsu Tharaz

Resident Resident
Local time
Tomorrow, 05:13
Joined
Dec 12, 2010
Messages
2,766
#59
DP could actually be INFP, I only said ENTJ because there seemed to be Fi but something seemed off like it wasn't dominant so I said ENTJ. He could still be ISFP or INFP, but might be EXTJ.
Daniel Pinchbeck? I'm watching a video of him now and he has very strong Ti, probably with Ne/Si, and seems introverted. So most likely INTP.

Joe Rogan has Fi and Te, with the Te seeming to be stronger, and also has Se and Ni. He seems extroverted. So ENTJ.

(I'm doing vocal analysis here)
 

Pizzabeak

Prolific Member
Local time
Today, 12:13
Joined
Jan 24, 2012
Messages
1,859
#60
No. He's ENFP or ESFP then. Pinchbeck wasn't an acid head, he more so has done aya rituals and stayed with the Hopi people to break open his head. He could be INFP, or maybe a T type. The episode with Vincent Horn clearly depicts him as INTP. Daniel might be different.
 

Artsu Tharaz

Resident Resident
Local time
Tomorrow, 05:13
Joined
Dec 12, 2010
Messages
2,766
#61
No. He's ENFP or ESFP then. Pinchbeck wasn't an acid head, he more so has done aya rituals and stayed with the Hopi people to break open his head. He could be INFP, or maybe a T type. The episode with Vincent Horn clearly depicts him as INTP. Daniel might be different.
I watched a bit of this video
His voice sounds inward and emotionally neutral.
 

Pizzabeak

Prolific Member
Local time
Today, 12:13
Joined
Jan 24, 2012
Messages
1,859
#62
If Joe Rogan is ENTJ then Ultra David is also ENTJ, because they clearly do the same thing (UD is a lawyer - Te). Rogan's Te only seems stronger because it's ENFP's 3rd function, which is a weird kind of unique "resting state" function that appears to be the most obvious most of the time. Any other functions are displayed throughout work, tasks, and activities; etc. So that doesn't make sense.

He also did an episode with Mac Lethal where they are clearly the same type - but I don't think Mac is ENTJ. Probably EXFP, which has Te. Different careers but similar paths.

Also his assistant Jamie is one of those ENTJs, so don't think they're both exactly quite the same thing.
 

Artsu Tharaz

Resident Resident
Local time
Tomorrow, 05:13
Joined
Dec 12, 2010
Messages
2,766
#63
If Joe Rogan is ENTJ then Ultra David is also ENTJ, because they clearly do the same thing (UD is a lawyer - Te). Rogan's Te only seem stronger because it's ENFP's 3rd function, which is a weird kind of unique "resting state" function that appears to be the most obvious most of the time. Any other functions are displayed throughout work, tasks, and activities; etc. So that doesn't make sense.

He also did an episode with Mac Lethal where they are clearly the same type - but I don't think Mac is ENTJ. Probably EXFP, which has Te. Different careers but similar paths.
Mac Lethal... ENTJ makes sense, but he seems to have a significantly wider vocal range than what I would expect for an ENTJ. He seems quite J though (more push than pull).

edit: not sure about UltraDavid
 

Pizzabeak

Prolific Member
Local time
Today, 12:13
Joined
Jan 24, 2012
Messages
1,859
#64
They're not ENTJ. There aren't that many. ENFP are more common. ENTJ are like INTJ, except bigger. Rogan isn't like an INTJ at all, except for intuitive adeptness. He's not doing Ni-Se, it's dominant Ne. The third function is some kind of weird unique "resting state" function that looks like it's the first one except it's more of a baseline regulator than anything to do with novelty or getting out of flow too much.
 

Artsu Tharaz

Resident Resident
Local time
Tomorrow, 05:13
Joined
Dec 12, 2010
Messages
2,766
#65
There aren't that many. ENFP are more common.
We don't know this for sure.

As far as I know, that idea is based on test results, and the tests are known to be highly inaccurate. e.g. an NJ is likely to score as a P, because of correlation between dichotomies.

And when you're talking about aspects of the media, the actual type distribution in the population matters even less. It depends on what the person is famous for to a large extent, although ENTJs are seemingly able to achieve success in a wide variety of fields.

I'm basing my typings off of voice and visual cues to get an idea for how their mind works. I take it you use a very different approach to typing.

He's not doing Ni-Se
Well, I'll describe it like this... as he talks, it's like he has the general idea of what he's saying and he's leading up to his main point. Ni often gives the impression of leading up to something. If he was Ne+Si, he would be brainstorming and going forward in an open-ended fashion, while emphasising certain points as if to say remember this.

(with Se, it's not telling you to remember the information or that they've specifically noted down the information, what Se does is to present you with a detail so that you experience it as they're re-experiencing it. It's about the moment)
 

Pizzabeak

Prolific Member
Local time
Today, 12:13
Joined
Jan 24, 2012
Messages
1,859
#66
We still know. There are some. It's still easier to find them, and point out ENFPs. Not just talking about media. I'm basing it off everything, not just a couple things. In INTPs the tertiary is literally a resting state because it's Si, all based on time, your personal ebb & flow, and vibrations. In ENFPs it's Te, so while a "resting state", they could still be doing stuff. Ultra David is really similar (even though they have different voices), and his assistant Jamie is probably ENTJ, and he's way different from Joe.

You could also be re-experiencing it. It isn't unique. He already brainstormed and is just communicating the idea.
 

Artsu Tharaz

Resident Resident
Local time
Tomorrow, 05:13
Joined
Dec 12, 2010
Messages
2,766
#67
He already brainstormed and is just communicating the idea.
If it's a conscious function, then you can directly see it being used in real time. Everyone uses all 8 functions, so there's going to be some implicit aspect of brainstorming regardless, but if it's being used consciously, then you can see it. "See" literally and figuratively.
 

Pizzabeak

Prolific Member
Local time
Today, 12:13
Joined
Jan 24, 2012
Messages
1,859
#68
I know some female ENFPs in real life and they're similar. Also, some INFP. And they're like him, except more introverted - they aren't INTJ. He holds a lot of info and mostly calls it back in a way, which is Si. I wouldn't say I relate to him that much, only through certain interests (I just remember him hosting FF when I was a kid). I'd say we vibe because Ne (watch the episode with Vincent Horn, INTP, from Buddha Geeks to see them go at it). On the other hand, if I'm INTP, Ti-Ne, then we could vibe due to him being ENTJ, the inverse, or opposite, of INTP, which is Te-Ni, and the traditional ways in which the theory and observations say they should. He doesn't seem like INTJ except more extraverted. Just developed tertiary Te, which is strong Fi, meaning ENFP not ENTJ. He's like ENTP except with Fi instead of Ti.

Case closed. Same with Pinchbeck. If he is INTP, which I can't think so, I thought he was ENTJ because they are inversed types. He doesn't seem lead Ti. I don't know what the hell system you're using and relying on, and whether you're even INFJ at this point given your apparent understand of the cognitive functions, but it seems off. You could still be INFJ, but he seems Fi-Te, not to mention Ni not Si. Could be INFP or a more Fi heavy ENTJ.
 

Artsu Tharaz

Resident Resident
Local time
Tomorrow, 05:13
Joined
Dec 12, 2010
Messages
2,766
#69
Vincent Horn, INTP
His voice sounds very emotional to me? I watched this video and it sounds like constant Fi, with very little Te, but in the video with Joe Rogan he does use Te a lot more.

Also, the pace of his talk is like a random walk where he anchors on the details.

Listen to this 45 seconds of Joe Rogan speaking:


He has the general idea, and he is fleshing out the idea by referencing concrete examples. He is not randomly moving and then anchoring in the octopus example, rather that's a concrete example that demonstrates the underlying idea. That's Ni+Se.

I don't know what the hell system you're using and relying on, and whether you're even INFJ at this point given your apparent understand of the cognitive functions, but it seems off.
Well, I mean, I'm being quite specific in what I'm basing the reads off of. I think typing should be done in real-time - you should be able to look at/listen to any specific moment of the person talking, and see cues which identify one function or another (or multiple at once).

Vibing/relating to someone has its own kind of merit, because sharing a cognitive configuration with someone does tend to mean that they'll think in a similar way to you, almost tautologically. It's hard to demonstrate that to another person, though, although you can point to two people who you believe to be the same type and say "look, these two people are similar", but then it depends on whether that person shares the same view.

I made a thread recently (https://intpforum.com/threads/experiential-proof-disproof-of-type.27396/) where I show perhaps my strongest reasoning for being INFJ. I observe my cognition, and usually it goes in an INFJ cognitive function order. I highly doubt that there are modifiers on my cognition that would be creating that artificially. So, I'm quite clear in being an INFJ.

I'm not really "relying on a system" so much as making observations based on the basics of type theory, e.g. Fe is extroverted feeling, which roughly means outwardly directing affect, so I listen to the direction that the emotion in a person's voice goes (inward and outward directed speech is easy to differentiate). I use multiple different approaches, but it's largely centred on the basic definitions and how I perceive those to manifest. It's experiential.
 

Pizzabeak

Prolific Member
Local time
Today, 12:13
Joined
Jan 24, 2012
Messages
1,859
#70
I haven't seen that episode in a long time so he could be INFP. I only meant it was a display of dominant Ne interacting with auxiliary Ne. I know some male INFPs in real life who are like Joe Rogan, except smaller in most ways. It's just the way he talks or interacts with people, because Ne is a communication function. So let's say he's a male ENFP for now.

Female ENFPs can have a similar vibe, except they're girls, so it'll inevitably be different. I don't know any male ENTJ archetypes that Joe fits under or looks similar to. He regularly admits he's dumb and invites guests to explain stuff (the 'experts'), which doesn't seem that much like ENTJ to me. Usually I don't think they'd relegate themselves like that. I have PKD down as IXFP, possibly N. Still stern and forthright, with ideas of what someone's self should or shouldn't do, rather than trying to think through various reasons or possibilities then getting caught up in a people pleasing Fe moment that possibly isn't as genuine. Fi gets too caught up on people, and being 'genuine', which is why ENTJ have more patience for people with no Fi than ENFP do, or ESFP; etc.

The voice thing is more Si or Se, rather than Fe/Fi, then it depends on where the N is in the functional stack. For example with me and aux Ne/tertiary Si, when I laugh I tend to do so "inwards" in a way and I can feel aware of my inner bodily sensations. With ENFP, it's more "broad", because they're extroverted, and their breath control can be different.

Vibing and whether two people agree depends on the nuance, which is why I said there could be 4 or 5 different archetypes of the same type. If it is Ni/Se, he could be ESFP then. ENTJ usually have goatees, and a more broad voice, which is Se. I know of one possible ENTJ who might seem kind of similar to Joe. Except I think Joe laughs too much and makes too many dick and fart jokes, which seems more like ENFP.
 

Artsu Tharaz

Resident Resident
Local time
Tomorrow, 05:13
Joined
Dec 12, 2010
Messages
2,766
#71
Ne is a communication function.
Since when? I thought Fe and Te were the communication functions.

He regularly admits he's dumb and invites guests to explain stuff (the 'experts'), which doesn't seem that much like ENTJ to me. Usually I don't think they'd relegate themselves like that.
What a person of a given type does or doesn't do comes down to how the type actually manifests, not on preconceived notions of how a type is supposed to manifest. Explanations like that move too far away from the fundamentals, and require a level of interpretation to understand which seems too individual-dependent.

If an ENTJ recognises that they are not an expert on something, would they not be ready to admit it, and thus relegate to the person who does know?

I have PKD down as IXFP, possibly N.
Who's PKD?

Fi gets too caught up on people, and being 'genuine', which is why ENTJ have more patience for people with no Fi than ENFP do, or ESFP; etc.
When you say "people with no Fi", are you referring to FJs and TPs? An ENTJ would tend to have more patience for a TP, an ExFP would have more patience for an FJ. That's generally speaking. It's about the relevant dichotomy, and if they have the opposite function, then they should be in touch with their unconscious.

The voice thing is more Si or Se, rather than Fe/Fi, then it depends on where the N is in the functional stack.
All functions and dichotomies effect the voice. I personally find the FiTe vs FeTi distinction to be probably the easiest to distinguish, but that doesn't mean it's objectively (i.e. for everyone) the easiest.

If it is Ni/Se, he could be ESFP then.
Well, that's the same functions. Compared to an ENTJ, an ESFP would be more emotional, they would have a harder time communicating/articulating, and be more laidback, amongst other things. Joe Rogan seems more emotionally neutral and in-charge to me. I can't see ESFP fitting too well. Plus, the Ni seems quite prominent.

ENTJ usually have goatees
Uh... well, I guess it's possible that they're more likely to have a goatee than other types. I don't often see people with goatees though. I doubt this is a true connection.
 

Artsu Tharaz

Resident Resident
Local time
Tomorrow, 05:13
Joined
Dec 12, 2010
Messages
2,766
#72
I observe my cognition, and usually it goes in an INFJ cognitive function order. I highly doubt that there are modifiers on my cognition that would be creating that artificially. So, I'm quite clear in being an INFJ.
I'll just add a correction to this... the fact that I type myself as an INFJ actually is a modifier on my cognition. It's possible that I've molded my brain into working like an INFJ's simply because I type myself as INFJ. But I don't believe that hypothesis to be the case, because there's so much corroborating evidence that I'm an INFJ. I relate to other INFJs, I get along with people or seek out stimulation that is in line with the INFJ function order, and so on.
 
Local time
Today, 12:13
Joined
Jan 24, 2012
Messages
1,859
#73
Ne is a communication function.
Since when? I thought Fe and Te were the communication functions.
All extroverted functions are pretty much communication functions. Ti is Fe. Fi decides on what people should say or do, Te is more about the logic used for Fi to feel good about its principles. INTJ use Ni or "Se" to communicate similarly. INTP use Ne, Fe is more about what decisions to use regarding the logic applied to come to that conclusion. So they're pretty much using both.
He regularly admits he's dumb and invites guests to explain stuff (the 'experts'), which doesn't seem that much like ENTJ to me. Usually I don't think they'd relegate themselves like that.
What a person of a given type does or doesn't do comes down to how the type actually manifests, not on preconceived notions of how a type is supposed to manifest. Explanations like that move too far away from the fundamentals, and require a level of interpretation to understand which seems too individual-dependent.

If an ENTJ recognises that they are not an expert on something, would they not be ready to admit it, and thus relegate to the person who does know?
There are 4 or 5 archetypes of each type. That's more so what happens anyway. I don't think they'd call themselves dumb, though, but may just express it more eloquently. Other ENFPs may be loathe to admit that much because too much Fi pride, but I'd say Joe is more mature at this point.

I have PKD down as IXFP, possibly N.
Who's PKD?
Philip K. Dick.
Fi gets too caught up on people, and being 'genuine', which is why ENTJ have more patience for people with no Fi than ENFP do, or ESFP; etc.
When you say "people with no Fi", are you referring to FJs and TPs? An ENTJ would tend to have more patience for a TP, an ExFP would have more patience for an FJ. That's generally speaking. It's about the relevant dichotomy, and if they have the opposite function, then they should be in touch with their unconscious.
Mainly INTPs. They get mad if you don't do Fi and generally disregard, because it looks like you failed to recognize it, which would mean you're not "aware", when in reality, it's just fucking stupid and basically retarded. No one has the time or energy for all that extra. And now, you should put more effort into integrating more Fi in your life because that's just the opposite of what I just said.
The voice thing is more Si or Se, rather than Fe/Fi, then it depends on where the N is in the functional stack.
All functions and dichotomies effect the voice. I personally find the FiTe vs FeTi distinction to be probably the easiest to distinguish, but that doesn't mean it's objectively (i.e. for everyone) the easiest.
They're all working in tandem, basically, which is what makes a type in the first place.
If it is Ni/Se, he could be ESFP then.
Well, that's the same functions. Compared to an ENTJ, an ESFP would be more emotional, they would have a harder time communicating/articulating, and be more laidback, amongst other things. Joe Rogan seems more emotionally neutral and in-charge to me. I can't see ESFP fitting too well. Plus, the Ni seems quite prominent.

ENTJ usually have goatees
Uh... well, I guess it's possible that they're more likely to have a goatee than other types. I don't often see people with goatees though. I doubt this is a true connection.
Photos of young Joe make him look ENFP. Plus his assistant Jamie is probably an ENTJ, and they're way different. Jamie is into sports (Se) and operates the equipment (Te). He appears to have little identity (inferior Fi), and what traits he does have, are all expressed through what he's doing (Te). Lead Te is inferior Fi. Joe's not inferior Fi, highly doubt it, even if he was extremely developed.
 
Local time
Today, 12:13
Joined
Jan 24, 2012
Messages
1,859
#74

Candace Owens is INTJ. Alternatively, she could be IXFJ (looks like there's Ti). She's not a scientist so some of the stuff she says sounds kind of odd, but I adjusted and allowed it for her to still be INTJ. Possibly INXJ. Definitely using logic, although she seems a tad colder than an INFJ would be even using Ti during arguments. They'd just be certain they were right and keep hammering away, whereas Te would be certain they were right as well, but they'd be more like a teacher than an asshole. Ti would want to prove the other person is stupid basically when confronted like that, Te has Fi, so they could do it too, but it'd be more of a "personal vengeance" type thing.
 
Local time
Tomorrow, 05:13
Joined
Dec 12, 2010
Messages
2,766
#75

From this video, I would say he has a more emotionally neutral (and inwardly drawing) voice. He seems to be using a lot of Si (emphasising what he's saying to drive the facts home), so I would say INTP.

Candace Owens is INTJ.
Her voice sounds very much Fe to me. Probably Ni.

but they'd be more like a teacher than an asshole.
I associate a teacher sort of approach with Fe, because Fe is trying to guide the person to an understanding. Te is like writing your argument on the whiteboard so everyone can see it. It's just trying to convey the logic of what they're saying, almost so that a computer would understand it. That's my impression, anyway.
 
Local time
Today, 12:13
Joined
Jan 24, 2012
Messages
1,859
#76
I had an INTJ professor for astronomy which is what I based that off of. I also had an INTP one, but kind of liked the J better.

And no. Dick probably isn't awkward enough to be INTP honestly, and having read his stuff, while it appeals to INTPs and many people on this board, as well as people who like sci-fi in general, I just don't think he is, although I may have thought so at one point. Aesop Rock is also INFP, into art as expression (Fi), through using Te (inferior). Te leads would just do it, and have the result be what it is. Fi dominants would have a pressing need to get something done and use various tools and equipment to do it (inferior Te, lead Fi) just so they can feel personally fulfilled. Te is just a means. In Te leads, it's an end.
 
Top Bottom